Bay-Bees – Have them, have lots of them and NOW, no matter what!, say some Christians Please see Part 2 of This Post
I was watching Pat Robertson today – by the way, I don’t always mean to single this guy out. A lot of his views about marriage, gender roles, babies, and other issues are similar to those of other male preachers and Christian talking heads.
Sooo. On a previous broadcast, Pat Robertson advised his Christian viewers to “out breed” their “opponents” (by which he meant Muslims, but I also suspect he was thinking of atheists, liberals, and other groups). You can read this post here at this blog for more about that.
Based on figures I have seen in books and blogs, currently about 50% of the American population is unmarried – this is also true of conservative Christians, 50% are unmarried. This includes never married, divorced, widowed.
It seems strange to me that Robertson and other Christian spokespersons and preachers keep insisting that Christians have more kids. About 20% of married couples do not have children, and who knows why that is. Maybe they have infertility issues, don’t want any, or can’t afford one.
When about 50% of American Christians are single, you’re asking the other 50% to crank out a lot of kids, and some of those 50% might be people over 40, 50, or 60 and don’t have the physical ability, energy, or health to keep up with a kid.
Your 50% of unmarried people technically are not supposed to be having sex. I know it’s popular to question this in some quarters – some Christians on other blogs actually argue that the Bible, and God, are fine and hunky-dory with fornication (sexual activity outside of marriage).
But no, God is not hunky-dory and okay with fornication- that fact is alluded to in many verses. In the Old Testament days, if a woman was not a virgin on her wedding night, she was to be stoned to death, if I recall correctly. She had to bring proof to the priests, via stained bridal sheets (sorry to be a bit crass, but it’s in the Scriptures), that she was a virgin on her wedding night, should her new husband claim she was not.
Obviously, since Christ, God has dropped the “stone her to death” routine, or whatever the penalty was at the time, but the fact that God called for a severe penalty at some point in history for fornication should be a huge CLUE that He is not “okay” with sex outside of marriage – HELLO.
I just find it really insulting, stupid, or unrealistic that some conservative Christians are bemoaning and fretting the decline of child birth among Christians. I can’t quite articulate it.
Maybe it’s because I’m over 40 years old and have never been married but wanted to be married that I find this annoying – that, and I also don’t think it’s anyone’s place to tell married couples when or how to have a baby. The Bible does not COMMAND all married couples to breed like rabbits, the “be fruitful” comment aside – I have never understood that “be fruitful” comment to be an iron-clad COMMANDMENT to all married couples forever, that they MUST follow or be damned by God.
These weenie TV preachers are asking Christian women to pop out more babies. I couldn’t pop out more kids if I wanted to, unless I went against biblical teachings about fornication and had a kid out of wedlock. Is that what the Pat Robertsons of the nation really want?
My other issue with the baby-mania I see occasionally brought up in Christian shows or blogs: they will tell younger Christians to have kids right away, even if they are not financially set to do so.
If you are in your 20s or even early 30s, ignore these people!
If you cannot financially afford kids and don’t feel right or secure in having them yet, then do not.
Let me tell you, if you have a baby and fall on hard economic times, Pat Robertson will not send you a check for $100,000 to help cover baby expenses.
Most Christians are dreadful about actually living out Christian teachings. I have seen this in my own life, and in testimonies by other Christian on other blogs.
Most of the time, when and if you approach another Christian, or a church, concerning emotional, practical, or financial help, they will refuse to help you!
When you are in need and hurting and approach your local church for help, you will most likely get lectured, judged, preached at, or ignored.
So if you are a young couple who just had a baby and don’t have money to buy formula, baby clothes, or diapers, and you approach your church for these staples, they will likely say NO.
There might be some churches that will help you. If you approach an older Christian woman at a church and tell her of your plight, she might go to Kroger’s for you and buy you a box of diapers, but from what I’ve seen in my own life and from other Christians, any overtures you need for help (diapers, money, rent money, food, shoes, a shoulder to cry on, whatever), will be met with indifference, lectures, criticisms, or a flat “no.”
Most Christians are not going to help you buy diapers, baby food, baby formula, baby clothes, a high chair, a car seat, or anything else.
Don’t give in to pressure by parents, Christian preachers or Christian authors to have a lot of babies if you are not ready for it.
These preachers are happy to lecture you to have ten babies, but when you need these same people to help you pay for diapers and baby food, they will turn you away. Taking care of any babies you have will fall almost entirely to you and you alone. These preachers want you to have 100 babies, but they don’t want any part in actually helping you raise them or pay for their needs.
Which is odder still, because most Christians are “pro life.” They will fight for the unborn, but for babies born to struggling Christian parents? I doubt it.
I’m not saying there are not ANY Christians who actually help people in need, but I’ve seen so many instances of Christians who refuse to provide for other people in need that it is NOT worth the risk to have a baby and hope that other Christians will help, if help is desired or needed.
And God stays quiet, too – when you pray and ask God to help pay your bills, your rent, to provide baby food, whatever you are praying for. Christians on TV like to call God “Jehovah Jireh, provider,” but in my own life, God’s answer has often been “No, I will not send or give you ‘x’.”
I’ve seen this phenomenon among other believers, too. They pray, pray, pray for financial help, a healing, whatever else, and God does not send them whatever it is they are praying for. So if you have a baby and need baby food, don’t expect to instantly get any baby food if you pray and ask for some.
You have to make choices in life that are safe and right FOR YOU. And if you don’t feel right or good about having children, then do not.
Christian Pundit 
How in the world can you on one line criticize people for not believing the Word of God concerning fornication and then in another line say you’re going to put a scripture to the side? We as Christians have to rightly divide the word as not to make it fit for ourselves and not fit for others. If God said to be fruitful and multiply that is exactly what it meant bring forth good fruit (Good fearing children that know right from wrong because you have lead by example) and multiply (when God multiplies 2 Christians it yields good fruit). We always have to not only consult God on every decision (praying always) but have to ask for wisdom in our decision making. I believe you took the message the wrong way because it’s a sore spot for you. Of course the preacher wasn’t telling unmarried Christians to have as many children as they can. If he was speaking on salvation and you are already saved he is not talking to you. If he is speaking on tithing and you already tithe than he is not talking to you. Every message is not for everyone. The Word says that Love is not easily offended. Were you acting/writing/speaking in LOVE? We should be quick to hear and slow to speak. Give yourself time to make heads or tails of the message, consult the Lord in prayer, and Curse not Gods anointed. That means put your mouth on/talk about the one God anoints. Gifts and callings are without repentance. So, even if the preacher is wrong you don’t have to listen. God looks at the heart of all mean, even him. Say “Forgive the preacher Lord for he knows not what he does, if he is wrong but if it is me forgive me. Straighten it out in my mind, if I’m wrong.” I am a person with STRONG opinions about everything and it takes God to back me down. After crying and asking God to forgive me for talking bad about someone who was actually right, or in their lane (as my Pastor says, Doing what God told them to do) I learned to say that little prayer first. It has helped me.
I didn’t read your entire rant. It’s too long. I usually don’t permit dissenting views to be published on this blog (see (Link): “Why I don’t permit dissenting views at this blog”).
I didn’t “push Scripture aside” in the manner you are making it sound. What I said is that I do not believe “be fruitful” is to be interpreted as an iron clad commandment for all married Christians to birth out kids at the rate of a rabbit. My understanding of that verse is different from that of some other people’s.
I can be offended at anything I want, whenever I want.
By the way, this is not just a sore spot “for me” (more that I find it annoying and stupid), but for a lot of other Christians. There are Child Free Christians, for example (they do not like children and do not want to have any), infertile Christian married women who cannot have kids, etc, who object to these messages.
Conservative Christians have made idols out of marriage and having children, and preachers pushing for Christians to have as many babies as they can is just another symptom of this problem.
They need to repent on this unbiblical obssession with the American 1950s culture “nuclear family.”
It’s impractical and irresponsible to tell people to have lots of kids if they don’t have the money to raise them, or don’t feel emotionally ready, or just do not like children. You as a Christian, and preachers, do not have a right to dictate to other Christians on personal matters such as when, if, or how many babies to have.
It’s also pointless and idiotic to tell Christians to pop out a lot of kids when 50% of Christians are unmarried and are not supposed to be engaging in sexual acts anyway.
Oftentimes, church members who are involved with adultery and fornication are actually rewarded. While those that live clean lives are punished. There are Carenets and other “pregnancy resource centers” popping up all over the place ready to provide diapers, baby food, and a whole lot of love from people who “aren’t judgemental” for teenagers who couldn’t restrain their hormones and got pregnant while still in high school. While at the same time, most SBC churches do not even have a singles ministry. I see “divorce care” signs popping up in church lawns all over the place to meet their “emotional needs” in a “nonjudgemental environment.” While at the same time SBC churches exalt the pleasures of married life during Valentine week without mentioning singles. But political correctness is so commonplace now in churches, people don’t think anything about it. Yet everybody asks why this country is going to hell in a handbasket. LOL. Even if a Baptist preacher doesn’t have a college degree, most would qualify for one in hypocracy overnight..
I agree, Christians who are actually living out the Christian faith are penalized or ignored by the church (or by Christian sources, such as professional blogs), while those who break the teachings get attention, help, money, sympathy, and affection.
I also agree that the Southern Baptist Churches (and any conservative Christian groups) ignore never-married, over- age- 30 Christians, while paying attention to the needs and edification of divorced people, pregnant teens, etc.
Not that I want churches, Christian lay persons, or pastors to be harsh and unloving against people who have been divorced or committed fornication, etc, but the church today is too, too lax about these things, to the point it makes it look like there is no point in following said teachings.
About the teen care pregnancy centers you mentioned. I’ve not heard of those before. I would assume those are for NON Christian teens. My impression is that Christians are not good about helping OTHER CHRISTIANS.
If a teen Christian girl gets pregnant and seeks free baby food from another Christian or from her church, they will probably tell her “no.”
I’ve seen many testimonies online from Christians, who in their greatest time of need (lost a job, spouse died, child died), they went to their pastor or church for financial assistance, asked for a ride to church, shoulder to cry on, or whatever, and were told “no” or “just pray more about it, as God to meet your needs.”
American Christians are generally pretty bad about actually getting off their asses and actually offering practical assistance to American Christians who need it, especially those who don’t fit the “married and age 25 – 45 with two kids at home” demographic. If you’re 75 years old and live alone, or 35 and never married, etc, churches don’t care about you or meeting your needs.
Most American conservative Christians remained obsessed with sending food to African orphans, complaining about liberals/ Democrats/ abortion/ homosexuality/ taxes, etc, than they do in actually helping Christians in their local communities – which is contra to a verse in Galatians.
ChristianPundit – The moral standards of this country have dropped so low, we’re not supposed to exist. Or if we do, it’s in theory. A lot of people today, including preachers, are talking about things they know nothing about. As far as sexual immorality and children out of wedlock, I think a lot of churches are contributing to the problem and don’t even know it. Marshmallow preachers continue to sugar coat everything so as not to make anybody feel uncomfortable while teenagers “hookup” behind the pews.
Yep, I know. Christians who are virgins past the age of 25 or 30 are thought to be more mythical than unicorns.
It really annoys, angers, and bothers some people – even “Christians” – on other blogs, when I mention I’m 40+ and haven’t had sex (am waiting for marriage at this point). They get defensive and angry.
Had a few people say things like, “what about women who were raped as girls, isn’t this emphasis on SP (sexual purity) dangerous or insensitive to them?,” when I had not even said anything about that issue and thought I was pretty clear I was talking about consensual sex and was not being too judgey, rude, or condemning about it but merely pointing out that virginity-until-marriage is NOT really supported by Baptists or other groups despite all their literature, books, and public statements to the contrary.
Had a few liberal-like Christians, or ex-Christians say that “purity until marriage” is propaganda of the patriarchy, is meant to suppress women, sexual purity is not supported in the Bible, is unrealistic for anyone to live by (even though I HAVE DONE IT MYSELF and made that clear), etc.
For whatever reason, a lot of women out there find the topic of SP very offensive. It’s not a sexist teaching, for males are called to abide by it to. Just because the culture is hypocritical and tends to give men a pass doesn’t null and void that SP is in the Bible and men are called to live it out as well as ladies.
I don’t want fornicators to be judged harshly or have rocks thrown at them as punishment – but – but – but-
I think most Christians these days give fornication and other sorts of sexual sin too easy a pass.
Preachers may tell the 15 year old to abstain, but what if you are 40+ and still abstaining? They don’t even mention you.
If you (the Christian virgin past the age of 25 / 30 / 40) are mentioned, you get told you’re a freak, loser, or have baggage, and you should be popping out babies else if not you are shirking your Christian duty -and this kind of insulting CRAP is in “Christian” sermons, TV shows, blogs, books.
I mentioned this on an old blog post here, but Christians try to soothe the doubts, concerns, or guilty feelings of people who did not abstain sexually, by saying stuff like, “remember, God will forgive you no matter how many times you sleep around,” or, “if you remain chaste after sleeping around, you can be made a “spiritual virgin” by accepting Christ,” or, “you can have a ‘secondary virginity.'”
I do appreciate that such Christians are trying to help people who are wounded over committing sexual sins -but-
By doing it in that manner, IMHO, it totally makes a mockery of those of us who have literally and actually remained virgins.
And such teachings sort of make it sound like nobody can remain SP past age 25/30. These speakers are (it appears to me) assuming ALL unmarried Christians past age of 25+ are sleeping around or have slept around at some point. That is offensive to me, since I did NOT sleep around.