Weak Argument Against Celibacy / Virginity / Sexual Purity by the Anti Sexual Purity Gestapo – Sexual Compatibility or Incompatibility – (i.e., Taking Human Beings For Test Spins – Humans As Sexual Commodities) (Part 2)
I’m afraid that the Anti Virginity, Anti Celibacy, and Anti Sexual Purity Gestapo I see on post-evangelical, ex-Christian, liberal Christian, secular feminist, and atheist type blogs that love to chortle at Christians they perceive as being “hicks,” for pushing things like early marriage (and no, I do not agree with Early Marriage advocacy, though some of my reasons are different from those of liberals and atheists), assume that dating always includes sexual activity – but it does not (as I discuss in Part 1).
I also see the overused chest nut of “possible sexual incompatibility” as yet another reason for being against celibacy or virginity, raised in such discussions, by the ex Christians, atheists, liberal Christians, political liberals, and sometimes, secular feminists.
This is another reason some people feel casual sex with many people is okay, or why pre marital sex with your fiance is okay – you know, you (the thinking goes) need to take the person you are dating on a test run in the sack, and if the sex is awful, you should call off the wedding.
That has to be one of the most shallow, selfish, idiotic, anti-virginity and anti sexual purity teachings and thought processes I keep coming across.
If you marry someone, and they are horrible in bed, you:
- -Educate the person about what you like and prefer.
- If you are a lady married to a guy who is horrible at sex, tell the guy what you want in bed. Or show him; place his hands where you want his hands, etc.
- -See a marriage or sex counselor to get professional input about how to improve things in this area
- -Masturbate -satisfy yourself if your spouse isn’t doing it for you
I mean, there are options available if you marry a person and the sex is lackluster.
It’s not as though you must have pre-martial sex with a person to determine whether they are right for you sexually or not.
Additionally, treating partners like cars that you take on test drives, to see if they suit you and your preferences, is dehumanizing to them and to you.
We’re talking about human beings here – not cars, not objects to be used and discarded and sized up like merchandise.
It’s somewhat like old, perverted men who travel to Thailand and other hot beds of sex tourism I see on TV news reports, the ones who “shop” for children under the age of twelve to have sex with.
These girls are lined up, as though they and their bodies are no more valuable than shoes on a store shelf, and these perverted Western men pick from among them.
That is similar to how people who advocate “Test drive lovers before you marry one!” operate.
You, the Test Driver, are not much better than old perverts who shop for little children for their own sexual use and pleasure.
You’re not. You can bicker all day about, “But consensual! Two consenting adults! Consensual!!,” but you’re using the same “consumer” mindset thought processes as those who purchase children for sex. You’re shopping for sex.
You’re comparing one adult lover to another, as though they are commodities (which one pleases YOU, which one meets YOUR preferences), as the old perverts do when they look up and down a row of little girls who are for sale.
Another problem with the “take ’em for a test drive to see if they knock your socks off in bed” view:
Even if you have pre-marital sex with the guy, and he is super awesome great in the sack, and, so you think, “Hmm, okay, I can marry this guy.”
In five, ten, 30 years, the sex may change.
After being married to this guy who once rocked your world in bed the first X years you dated, you or he may later suffer job stress, health problems, or lack of libido, or who knows what other trials in life that sap interest in sex, and you end up with lousy sex, or none at all.
If you dump someone due to diminished- greatness- of- sex over the course of your marriage, you may be a little selfish, or place too much emphasis on sex.
It’s like middle aged men who dump their 38 year old wife for a 23 year old secretary, especially if the wife being dumped popped out two or three babies for him.
He doesn’t find his 38 year old wife’s post baby body hot, or the married sex hot anymore, so he dumps her in favor of a new model.
That sort of situation pisses off a hella lot of women (rightly so, they should find it offensive), but these same women are fine with the,
“Oh, yes, you should have sex with a person before you’re married, to see if you are compatible in bed!” view…
which is really not much different than a married, 40 year old man dumping his 38 year old wife for a 23 year old. It’s the same principle at work.
Both are using the “Test Drive, I can and should trade it in for a better, newer, brand” mentality.
I’ve read enough letters to “Dear Abby” and “Can This Marriage Be Saved?” columns over the years to see that not only do people change as individuals over time, but so do couples, and their sex lives.
If you marry at age 28, your marriage is not necessarily going to be the same at age 38, 48, or 58 as it was at age 28. That goes for your bodies and sex lives, too.
Men experience male menopause as they age. Women get menopause. Sometimes women’s bodies change after they have babies (if they have babies). Hormones and energy levels go up and down, which impacts people’s emotions, bodies, and sexual reactions.
The “great sex” you had prior to marriage with your sweetie at age 20 or 25 is not guaranteed to last into your 30s, 40s, and older with that same guy.
If your mentality is to judge someone based solely or primarily on how they perform in the sack to your benefit and what rocks your world, and then rate their “marriage-ablity” based on their sexual performance, I would guess that you likely don’t have a mature view of sex, people, or marriage.
I don’t know how to properly articulate this next thought of mine. It’s going to come out jumbled and disjointed.
In this day and age, considering how easily available porn is, as well as its widespread consumption, and particularly if you are currently under age 30 as this is being posted (January 2014), who is dating a guy also under 30, you are apt to end up dating or marrying a guy who was brought up by porn from his childhood to now. And that is not a good thing.
I have read many articles about the negative effects of porn on people, reports and studies that say pornography gives males who view it regularly (especially porn that has come out since the late 1990s, 2000) a warped view of women, sex, marriage, and relationships.
If you’re basing your acceptance of martial partner on pre-martial sex acts, that is not wise, considering that people today have so many hang-ups about sex, due in part to the over-use of porn.
From what I have read by authors who study pornography and its impact on people and culture, porn has steadily gotten worse over the decades (porn has become even more tawdry and debased than it was in previous generations).
What was considered hard core porn (shots of anal sex and whatever) is now included in mainstream, soft core porn, and considered the norm.
End result: pre-martial sex is not always or necessarily going to be an accurate barometer of relationship success or happiness, sexual or otherwise.
The guy you are dating and considering boinking may have some pretty messed up ideas about sex, women, dating and marriage to start with, thanks to his porn viewing.
Boinking him prior to marriage to see if he can bring you to orgasm is not going to guarantee a lasting marriage, or guarantee an on going, great married sex life.
Even at my age (forties), this is a consideration. Suppose I start dating a guy now, who is 45 who has been divorced since he was 36 years of age. Maybe he has been looking at and using pornography the entire post-divorce time.
Maybe he once had normal views about women and sex, and would have made an acceptable spouse, but the porn has warped his views of women and sex in the meantime, since he divorced at 36.
Even if I had pre marital sex with this guy a time or two, and I deemed the time in the sack thrilling, there may be other issues going on with him that won’t show up in due time.
Or, maybe after we marry, he will start demanding I do more and more outrageous sexual acts to match the trash he sees couples doing in porn films.
I would not be cool with that, and most women would not either – though there are some warped, pervy, idiotic women who use porn and claim they think porn is just groovy, but they thankfully seem to be in the minority.
With most women, the vibe I get from them from reading porn studies and articles about contemporary relationships, do not want ‘porn styled’ sex.
My point is that sleeping with a person before marriage to see if you are “compatible” is not a guarantee that they or the sex is going to stay the same. It may go downhill after you marry.
Even if the sex stays awesome, maybe his habits – such as leaving the cap off the toothpaste or watching football all day, rather than holding down a job and helping you with the bills – will piss you off.
— SEX AND THE ABUSIVE HUSBAND —
In one book I read about women who were abused by boyfriends and husbands, it was interesting that the book author, a domestic abuse counselor, included a chapter about sexuality.
The author mentioned that some of the most abusive men were – according to the wives he spoke with – stunning in bed.
These women hated these men, felt these men were dirt bags, were afraid of them (for these men were physically abusive or too controlling), yet, they would recall with the counselor, in a dreamy face, far away look in their eye, and tone of voice, how super great these dudes were at sex.
One woman was quoted in this book as saying something like, “If I could just have that aspect of him, the great sex, and divide off the abusive part, it would have been a great relationship.”
So you see, not even “great sex” is enough to keep women in a relationship.
If the guy is an abusive dickwad, it doesn’t matter how much he thrills you at sex, if he brings you to multiple orgasms, goes down on you, or whatever rocks your world.
If your honey bunny is spending the rest of the relationship having affairs with other women, giving you black eyes and broken ribs, and / or not holding a job down and helping you with bills and housework – after so many months or years of any or all of that, even his great sexual ability won’t be enough to hold you or your interest.
You will be pining for ‘Mr. Sexually Boring, Yet Reliable, Stable, Steadily Employed, and Faithful.’
And, if your married sex life is dull, or not to your liking: TELL your husband. He can’t read your mind.
Tutor him in the sack where and how you want to be touched or whatever.
Give him books with titles and content like, “How to give your wife great sex” “Sex 101,” “Sex for Dummies.”
Drag his ass to a certified, professional sex therapist (and I don’t mean the wacko idiots who literally have sex with their patients).
If it gets to the point you absolutely cannot stand a sexless or crummy-sex marriage, and all these other avenues have failed, then consider divorcing your spouse’s ass and marrying some other guy – or stay single and celibate.
But you don’t have to run around fornicating all over the place to take human beings on “test drives.”
Can you imagine being on the receiving end of this situation, where you are totally into some guy, think it’s great, you’re hoping it’s going somewhere, but you have pre-marital sex, and after the sex, he holds up a score card reading “1.5.”
You ask, “What the hell is that?”
And he says, “I just judged you, your sexual performance. You only rank as a 1.5 in the sack, on a scale of 1 – 10, with ten being great. I’m afraid I have to break up with you now; the sex is awful. I’m moving on and trying out other women in the bedroom.”
Uh, yeah – you can claim all you want, “Oh, that wouldn’t bother me in the least, I’m an adult and can handle it,” but yes, it would bother you.
It would be a blow to your ego, and you would feel used.
I just know there are women out there who fancy themselves totally sexually liberated, “with-it” chicks (they usually annoy me) who would bloviate all day about how, “Oh gosh, no, I wouldn’t be the least phased if a guy did that to me, why, I would totally understand. Sex is no big deal!” – But I don’t buy that.
Nobody likes being judged and dismissed, especially not in regards to things like this.
And I find it peculiar that a person would reject someone totally or primarily based on bedroom performance, as though their other qualities (intelligence, kindness, stability, reliability, etc), don’t matter.
As messed up about sex, dating, and marriage views as Southern Baptists, Reformed, fundamentalists, and evangelicals can be, with their overly strict views of sex, your Christian libertines, ex Christians, Christian liberals, emergents, secular feminists, and atheists can be just as incorrect or strange in their views about sex, dating, and marriage.
I don’t think either side recognizes how thoroughly messed up both are, though.
On a last note, I also find the “Test Drive” view disturbing because it sexualizes a person too much (and leads to the isolation of singles even more). People are more than just their sexuality, people are more than sex acts.
It is possible for men and women to be “just friends,” except for living in a sex-saturated culture that insists on reading sex into any and all situations. I have written about that before so won’t get into it here.
(Part 1: (Link): Strawman Argument Against Celibacy / Virginity and Sexual Purity by the Anti Sexual Purity Gestapo – The First Person Argument – vis a vis Early Marriage debate (Part 1))
Related posts this blog:
(Link): The Nauseating Push by Evangelicals for Early Marriage
(Link): What’s Wrong With PreMarital Sex, Cohabitation and Watching Porn? Apologist Sean McDowell Answers – Critique: Some Christians Marketing Sexual Abstinence as “Purity in Jesus”
(Link): Christian Preacher Admits He Won’t Preach About Sexuality For Fear It May Offend Sexual Sinners
(Link): How the Sexual Revolution Ruined Friendship – Also: If Christians Truly Believed in Celibacy and Virginity, they would stop adhering to certain sexual and gender stereotypes that work against both
(Link): Topics: Friendship is Possible / Sexualization By Culture Of All Relationships
(Link): Christian Early Marriage Position Advocates A Low View of Celibacy and Virginity and Adult Singleness – another example: Justin Deeter Blog about Early Marriage
(Link): Douglas Wilson and Christian Response FAIL to Sexual Sin – No Body Can Resist Sex – supposedly – Re Celibacy
(Link): Inconsistency on Feminist Site – Choices Have Consequences
(Link): Researchers measure increasing sexualization of images in magazines
(Link): The Christian and Non Christian Phenomenon of Virgin Shaming and Celibate Shaming
(Link): Getting Married Does Not Necessarily Guarantee Frequent Hot Satisfying Sexy Sex / (also discussed): Gender and Sex Stereotypes (article)
(Link): Letter to Advice Columnist: Husband Upset That Wife Masturbates – Marriage Doesn’t Guarantee Hot Regular Sex For Both or Either Partner, Contra Usual Christian Claims
(Link): Christian Stereotypes About Female Sexuality : All Unmarried Women Are Supposedly Hyper Sexed Harlots – But All Married Ones are Supposedly Frigid or Totally Uninterested in Sex
(Link): Self Control – everyone has it, is capable of it, but most choose not to use it (New Study Says Conservatives Have Better Self Control Than Liberals)
6 thoughts on “Weak Argument Against Celibacy / Virginity / Sexual Purity by the Anti Sexual Purity Gestapo – Sexual Compatibility or Incompatibility – (ie, Taking Human Beings For Test Spins – Humans As Sexual Commodities) (Part 2)”
Again, it’s heart-wrenching to hear “Christians” hating the concept of virginity or sex with marriage. That hurts a whole lot to find out how there are so many it seems. I almost can’t find anybody who isn’t doing so. You are the oddball now for it and it does hurt a lot. I’ve actually had my worst nights because of this whole topic. I like you have wanted to have sex, but unlike the world, I’ve only wanted it with my one girl holding me close. I’ve been so far from perfect in my life. I have failed so miserably and have vices that I still strive and fight on. This one probably tops the list for me, though. Daydreams are not easy when it’s her you dream of. I have a hard time thinking about it now potentially not happening. I will never condemn you like others described for being in ruts over being a virgin late in life. This has been so painful for me as well. Daily living sacrifice.
I just say that we (and other adult virgins like us) need to start bucking the trend. Maybe start a support group for it, I don’t know. But I will say that for me, virgin is not something I’ve loved to proclaim in this world. Thanks for sharing another reason why I haven’t been able to.
Thanks for the well wishes as well, CP. If there is any constellation prize I could possibly give out for you, I technically don’t know who you are, but you sound like someone who would be a great partner. You sound quite strong and quite intelligent. Once again, I don’t even know who you are, but it is the truth. I know God loves you, but the guys who are near ya who don’t aren’t looking right to not miss or overlook you. That’s just me as a 24 year-old guy.
All of these stupid arguments are adding to the incentive that singleness truly is so good. I actually when not feeling worldly condemnation, feel great about being a celibate male. I think celibacy is truly the best way for me. All of these things just make romantic relationships so complicated. Now you have to “perform” in order to show you are worthwhile. This is such a waste to me. Why go through all of this? Celibacy is just shining in my eyes. Too bad celibacy and virginity do not shine in most people’s eyes, and that includes the church too.
Relationships are a completely foreign deal to me, but if this is how they are, yikes! Better I stay away. Everything is just so physical and lust-driven. It seems quite dysfunctional to me.
@ Tyler, yes, the arguments I mention above – the one that you should supposedly have sex with a person before committing to them further, to ensure there is sexual compatibility – is one that comes up often on certain blogs, Facebook groups, and sites, mostly by ex-Christians, theologically and socially liberal Christians, and other such groups.
I recognize that some conservative Christians and social conservatives can hold some incorrect or strange views about sex, gender roles, dating, marriage, etc, but a lot of the people who are left wing (and/or ex-Christians) are far too permissive in regards in these areas, and I don’t believe being too permissive corrects for being overly strict.
Some of their (liberal, atheist, ex Christian, etc) views about sex and dating are just as messed up or weird as the social cons, fundamentalists, and other groups they complain about on their sites.
Yeah, I know these people aren’t really considered “Christians” at any slightest, but their view is the prevailing majority today. With studies saying that 4% of people will be a virgin past age 25, this does very little towards being confident that anyone else is waiting with you. Most of the people I know at or around my age already have a child, illegitimate or no. So I am an oddball there. Now I am even more odd for being a virgin at age 24. I know it’s way less older than you are, CP, but it is simply weird nonetheless for me. This is especially strong with me being in a state where “family values” are displayed everywhere, from church to political campaigns. Ugh.
You are so right when you say that it is complete exploitation to have sex with a person in order to judge whether or not a couple should stay together. It’s basically pressure. How terrible is that! If that’s dating, I would hope to never do it.
However, I don’t think they’ll consider me anyway since I am committed to trying to remain a virgin. Most girls would probably expect sex at some point and they’ll be probably not date me because I’m a virgin. This is something I have in a sense resigned into believing true. I’m not probably going to get many dates with the v-card. Oh,well. I do hope that things start turning up for you, though. I do hope there is some guy takes you on for a relationship and then marriage. I hope that for you. I’m not so sure for me.
It is so awful that virginity is such a disease today. I hate it.
I expect Non Christians to view virginity as a disease (which is strange, since most of them claim to be so open minded about all other forms of sexual choice), but a lot of Christians have accepted the same mindset and attack virginity now, too.
I suspect that is because more and more Christians are having sex before marriage. I think it would take a very strong preacher to stand up at the pulpit and go against the tide of culture and call pre-marital sex a sin.
Thank you for the well wishes, and I hope everything works out okay for you as well. 🙂
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