Christian TV Show Host Pat Robertson is Fine With Trandgenderism

Pat Robertson is Fine With Trandgenderism

Pat Robertson could provide enough material for a stand alone blog.

Some of the links below are from politically conservative sites, some might be from liberal sites, some are from pro-homosexual sites:

(Link): Pat Robertson on Sex Changes: “I Don’t Think It’s A Sin”

(Link): LIBERALS PRAISE PAT ROBERTSON AFTER SHOCKING TRANSGENDER COMMENTS: ‘I DON’T THINK THERE’S ANY SIN ASSOCIATED WITH THAT’

    “I think there are men who are in a woman’s body. It’s very rare, but it’s true,” he said. “Or women that are in men’s bodies and that they want a sex change and that is a very permanent thing, believe me, when you have certain body parts amputated and you have shot up with various kinds of hormones.”

    Robertson called the procedure “radical” and proceeded to make the most intriguing and controversial comments on the subject — views that are earning him praise among left-of-center blogs that typically lambaste his comments about gays.

    “I don’t think there’s any sin associated with that,” he continued. “I don’t condemn somebody for doing that.”

(Link): Pat Robertson Says “I Don’t Think There Is Any Sin Associated” with Sex Changes

This is from a pro homosexuality site:
(Link): Pat Robertson Refuses to Condemn Trans People

—————————
Related posts this blog:

(Link): Robertson Defends His Horrible Advice to Married Woman

(Link): “He’s Got Muscles” – Pat Robertson Weirdness (Discussing Tebow’s Sexiness)

(Link): Pat Robertson Expects Men to Commit Sexual Sin (and it’s not the first time)

(Link): Advocate of Family Values Doesn’t Uphold Family Values | Stop Asking Pat Robertson for Advice America!

(Link): Pat Robertson: (basically): Pre Marital Sex is Okay (or to be totally expected) Because People are “Sexual Beings”

You Know Marriage Has Been Made an Idol by Christians When… (Christian guy asks: ‘do you need to be married to get into heaven’)

You Know Marriage Has Been Made an Idol by Christians When… (Christian guy asks: ‘do you need to be married to get into heaven’)

I was watching a late night repeat of Christian TV show “The 700 Club,” when they got to their “Bring It On” segment. This is where the show hosts, sometimes including Pat Robertson, answer viewer mail questions.

Some guy, Jim, actually wrote in to ask,

    “I read an article which said that only married people can enter the Kingdom of God. While I cannot find this anywhere in the Bible, I’m worried now because I am destined to be single forever. Even though I believe in Jesus as my Savior, does this mean I’m going to hell?”
    — JIM

😯 Holy. Freaking. Cow.

How bad has Christian idolatry of marriage become when people think they have to be married to receive eternal salvation??? ❓ ❗ ❓ ❗ ❓ 😡

Even if this guy read this crazy, horrible idea in a Mormon publication, it speaks volumes of Christian idolization of marriage that some poor Christian guy thinks it even sounds biblical or remotely true.

Here is the video where the guy asks the show hosts if he needs to be married to receive salvation…

(Link): Bring It On – 700 Club – viewer asks “Do I have to be married to get into Heaven”
aired July 26, 2013

You can also watch it here:

(Video on You Tube)
—————————–
Related links this blog

(Link): Mormons and Christians Make Family, Marriage, Having Children Into Idols

(Link): When Mormonism Sounds Like Gender Complementarian Christianity – Also: Man Shortage in Mormonism Just Like Christianity

(Link): Modesty Teachings – When Mormons Sound like Christians and Gender Complementarians

(Link): The Deification of Family and Marriage (re: Kyle Idleman book)

(Link): Do You Rate Your Family Too High? (Christians Who Idolize the Family) (article)

(Link): Salvation By Marriage Alone – The Over Emphasis Upon Marriage by Conservative Christians Evangelicals Southern Baptists

(Link): Family as “The” Backbone of Society? – It’s Not In The Bible

(Link): Christians and Churches Discriminate Against Unmarried People / Singles

(Link): A Critique of the Family-Integrated Church Movement by Brian Borgman – Christians turning the family into an idol

(Link): If the Family Is Central, Christ Isn’t

Pat Robertson: (basically): Pre Marital Sex is Okay (or to be totally expected) Because People are “Sexual Beings”

Pat Robertson: (basically): Pre Marital Sex is Okay (or to be totally expected) Because People are “Sexual Beings”

On Today’s Bring It On segment (Bring It On consists of television viewers asking advice of The 700 Club show hosts):

The female co-host agreed with Robertson’s position, saying if God doesn’t permit sexual sinners into heaven, “a whole lot of people wouldn’t make it in.”

You can watch that segment here: LINK: Bring It On video

Some woman wrote in saying she did the pre marital nasty and popped out a kid as a result of that years ago, and she now assumes God will not let her into heaven as a result.

(I was not aware that the only un-forgivable sin the Bible mentions is pre-marital coitus – or having children out of wedlock. It is utterly remarkable how completely ignorant some people are about Christianity. Does this woman never read a Bible?)

About people being “sexual,” Robertson feels that way especially about “young people.” Robertson made it clear that young people can’t but help get all sexy sexified and do the sex because of their “hormones.”

It’s not like anyone past 25 years old ever has any sexual urges, there Pat. Dream on.

I managed to avoid giving in to sex as a teen and 20-something, despite the sexual urges and hormones: it’s called “self control,” Pat.

Remember also, I posted on an older blog entry that Robertson had sex with his wife before marriage, resulting in their first son (search for the name “Pat Roberston” on the upper right side of this blog, in the search field, to find that post). Maybe Robertson’s own dalliance is why the dude is typically so easy on sexual sin.

Interestingly, and on the same show, Robertson shows no tendency to forgive a guy who has a porn habit.

Another woman wrote in to say her current boyfriend (BF) admitted that two years ago he loved him some porn, but now says due to therapy, he doesn’t touch the stuff.

Robertson still advises the woman to drop ex-porn boy like a hot potato. Why so forgiving about a woman who popped a kid due to pre- marital sex, but no mercy for some guy who USED TO have a dirty web site addiction?

Anyway, contra Robertson: while it may be true that some people have sex before marriage, not all of them do.

Not advocating here that Christians bash in the heads of fornicators or unduly shame them, but really, what a slap in the face to Christian celibates past the age of 30 for these Christian spokespersons who dismiss sexual sin with a shrug of the shoulders and a, “Meh, every body does it, so don’t worry about it” stance. And this stance is regularly adopted by Robertson and Christian bloggers, and preachers I see on TBN (Christian network).
____________________________
Related posts this blog:

(Link): Why So Much Fornication – Because Christians Have No Expectation of Sexual Purity

(Link): No, Christians and Churches Do Not Idolize Virginity and Sexual Purity

(Link):  Some Researchers Argue that Shame Should Be Used to Treat Sexual Compulsions

(Link): Advocate of Family Values [Pat Robertson] Doesn’t Uphold Family Values | Stop Asking Pat Robertson for Advice America!

(Link): Emergent Christian Guy Says Christians Need to “Celebrate Pre Marital Sex” (Fornication)

(Link): Christian Response FAIL to Sexual Sin – Easy Forgivism

(Link): Pat Robertson to married woman: All men are cheaters and sex crazed horn dogs, but that’s okay because they’re men

(Link): Are Christians Tossing Out Prohibitions Against Pre Martial Sex (radio show)

(Link): Pat Robertson Expects Men to Commit Sexual Sin (and it’s not the first time)

“He’s Got Muscles” – Pat Robertson Weirdness (Discussing Tebow’s Sexiness)

“He’s got muscles” – Pat Robertson Weirdness (Discussing Tebow’s Sexiness)

I almost forgot about this! On the June 11, 2013 broadcast of “The 700 Club,” host Pat Roberston was talking about Tim Tebow, the football player.

Robertson got a little nutty, though, going into details about Tebow’s physique. If I can find video of it on You Tube, I’ll add it to this post.

I don’t recall Robertson’s exact words, but he mentioned something about Tim Tebow’s “muscular body,” and I think Tebow’s “wide shoulders” and developed chest.

And I sat there listening, thinking, “What the hell? Did I just hear Robertson describe Tim Tebow like a randy woman would a Chippendale’s dancer in Vegas? I do believe I did. Ew. There is just something wrong about that.”

Continue reading ““He’s Got Muscles” – Pat Robertson Weirdness (Discussing Tebow’s Sexiness)”

Robertson Defends His Horrible Advice to Married Woman

Robertson Defends His Horrible Advice to Married Woman

On today’s broadcast of “The 700 Club,” Pat Robertson’s co host, Terri, read a message from a woman who had divorced years ago and said she thought Robertson’s advice was great and she wishes she had heard that advice years ago.

This is the same awful advice Robertson was dragged over the coals for a week ago, because he did not hold the cheating male spouse accountable for his cheating but blamed the cheating on the wife.

Out of the 100,000 people who heard Robertson’s advice, 999,999 of them thought it was sexist and horrible, but one lady, one (who wrote their show today) found it sage and helpful.

Today, Robertson again brushed off the sexism and crappiness of his advice by saying, “I’m not “PC” in case you haven’t noticed.”

You can watch and listen to Robertson defend his lousy advice here:

(Link): Pat Robertson Bring It On, Defends Lousy Sexist Advice

Robertson said in that video that only Non Christians are attacking him for that advice: wrong. I’ve been a life long Christian (on the edge of agnosticism lately), and I found his advice sexist and deplorable, and I’ve seen other Christians online who thought his advice was terrible.

Read more about this topic here on this blog:

(Link): Pat Robertson Expects Men to Commit Sexual Sin (and it’s not the first time)

(Link): Pat Robertson to married woman: All men are cheaters and sex crazed horn dogs, but that’s okay because they’re men

(Link): Advocate of Family Values Doesn’t Uphold Family Values | Stop Asking Pat Robertson for Advice America!


Related Post:

(Link):  Women: Stop Asking Pat Robertson For Romantic Relationship Advice – Whether You Are Divorced or Single  – Pat Robertson Replies to Letter from Four Time Divorced Woman Who Wants to Know If God Will Send Her a Non-Abusive Husband

 

Preachers Who Use Strippers, Hula Girls, Topless Hunky Men, and Strip Poles During Church Services and Give Sex Diplomas to Teens – Yes, Really

Preachers Who Use Strippers, Hula Girls, Topless Hunky Men, and Strip Poles During Church Services and Give Sex Diplomas to Teens – Yes, Really

Some pastors have not ruled out using strippers in future church services (anything to lure in the un-saved to church!), while others have used hula girls and topless muscular men.

The host of the following radio show also discusses Christian television show host’s Pat Robertson’s view point that all men are horn dogs who are sex-obsessed, so you can’t blame a man for cheating on his spouse. (I wrote about Robertson on this topic (Link): here and (Link): here).

Here’s the radio show:

(Link): PERRY NOBLE HASN’T RULED OUT USING STRIPPERS IN CHURCH (also mentions Pat Robertson’s views that all men are sex obsessed, and a church that used hula girl and topless men in services)

Related links other sites:

This next link below: the strict gender role stereotyping and the assumptions of what either gender wants is disgusting.

Not all men are into strippers, like football, and not all women are into teddy bears, hearts, rainbows, and being “touchie feelie.”

I had a male co-worker once who HATED sports (and he was HETERO, and he later got married to a woman and had a kid by her), and not only was this guy BORED with football and other sports, but he said he hated being around men who talked about sports incessantly.

Had a female co-worker who adores college football, and an Aunt who loves football.

My ex used to bring me roses and do other typical romantic stuff, and I usually didn’t care for it.

I was a tom-boy in childhood (I hated Barbie and other dolls; I preferred playing with trucks, Planet of the Apes action figures, etc.), and in adulthood, I differ from the stereotypical “girly-girl” churches expect women to be.

Churches need to stop perpetuating gender stereotypes, because people cannot be neatly categorized into little boxes. Even if 90% of all females are all “love ‘n rainbows” all the time, it makes the other ten percent feel left out and alienated in these sermons.

Also: a lot of women LIKE VIDEO GAMES, and I mean the violent ones, not “dress- a- pony.”

(Link): Maverick pastor gets crowds streaming into church after erecting a stripper pole behind pulpit

    A local pastor said he put a stripper pole on his pulpit to help preach his message.

    It may raise some eyebrows, but Pastor Mike Scruggs said he’s hoping it will save some marriages. Scruggs admits he’s anything but a traditional pulpit preacher.” We try to make it relevant, straightforward.

    We don’t sugarcoat anything,” he said. On Friday, Scruggs’ sermon series drew a packed house at the Light of Word Ministries on Colerain Avenue.” We talk about sex. We talk about drugs. We talk about faith. We talk about relationships…, things that people are dealing with on a day-to-day basis,” Scruggs said.
    The series of sermons is called the “Battle of the Sexes,” with some rather interesting visual props.” On one side, (we’ll have) what men want or desire: your stripper pole, your video games, your sports,” Scruggs said.

    “The woman’s side (is) orderly, neat. It’s all about love, candy, teddy bears, roses and being wined and dined and cherished.”

    Scruggs said his church focuses on real situations and brings godly solutions.” We push the envelope, that’s true,” he said.

Continue reading “Preachers Who Use Strippers, Hula Girls, Topless Hunky Men, and Strip Poles During Church Services and Give Sex Diplomas to Teens – Yes, Really”

Advocate of Family Values Doesn’t Uphold Family Values | Stop Asking Pat Robertson for Advice America!

Advocate of Family Values Doesn’t Uphold Family Values (Re Pat Robertson)

Why do people write Robertson for advice, espeically women?

Robertson is currently an 82 or 83 year old “gender complementarian” who has very definite views about the roles men and women are to play, ones which are rooted in a faulty understanding of certain biblical passages and stuck in 1950s American culture. If you are a woman and write to him with a question, he will usually take the husband’s side.

Women of America: stop writing Robertson questions! Stop asking him questions via the “Bring It On” online section of his “700 Club” site. Stop it. He doesn’t have anything valuable or sensitive to say about most life situations.

Pat Robertson promotes himself as being all about “family values.” But he doesn’t uphold family values in his private life, and he doesn’t support them when answering viewer questions to his television show.

I am using Robertson as an example, because there are already so many videos online of him and his sexist, anti-family values to point to, but he is by no means the only Christian champion of “family values” I’ve seen who is a hypocrite on the issues of marriage, divorce, spousal abuse, etc.

At one time, Robertson was a Southern Baptist preacher. That is also alarming, because SBC (Southern Baptist Churches/ Convention) promotes itself as being all about family values and traditional values.

Hell, I live out family values more often and more consistently than most SBC guys or Robertson, and I’ve never married, I’m a woman, never had a kid, never had sex outside of marriage, and I’m borderline agnostic these days.

I’m not having sex outside marriage, I’m not telling married men it’s okay for them to cheat on their wife, I’m not advocating that people divorce their sick spouse, etc.

Pat Robertson had pre-marital sex. His first son was born out of wedlock. However, Robertson periodically has “anti porn,” and “anti- sexually explicit material brought in to or taught to college kids” spokespersons on his 700 Club show.

Here is a guy lecturing the rest of us to keep our skirts down and legs crossed, but he’s engaged in sexual immorality himself.

Here are some links about Robertson’s pre-marital fornication and resultant illegitimate son:

(Link): Pat Robertson Lashes Accusers

    by By Rogers Worthington, Chicago Tribune.
    Published 1987
    On Friday, Robertson`s wife and son appeared on the Christian Broadcasting Network and said they have a loving home untouched by concern over Tim Robertson being conceived out of wedlock, United Press International reported.

    Dede Robertson said the public revelation surrounding her son’s conception stung at first, but added, “The freedom that I’m feeling and the prayers that I’m feeling have lifted me up.”

On to the next Robertson anti-family, anti- traditional marriage, anti- traditional values gaffe.

Contrary to what most Christians assume, Christ and the Bible does NOT teach that divorce is acceptable only in cases of
1. atheist spouse
2. adultery

(Don’t believe me about what the Bible says about divorce that it’s permissible in situations other than atheist spouse/adultery? (Link): Read this)

However, that does not mean that the Bible sanctions, or that it’s ethically okay, for a husband to divorce a spouse because the spouse is sick, yet that is precisely what Robertson advocated.

(Link to You Tube video): Televangelist Pat Robertson Condones Divorcing a Spouse With Alzheimers Disease

(Link): Divorce Wife With Alzheimer’s – Pat Robertson (hosted by Young Turks on You Tube)

Robertson claims to be “pro marriage,” but here he is taking a low view of marriage by telling husbands it’s okay to dump a sick spouse and divorce her. How is advocating the dissolution of a family over such an invalid reason “pro-marriage,” or “pro-family values”? It’s not. Yet Robertson has the nerve to keep passing himself off as a “family values” supporter.

(Link): Robertson: Divorce Your Wife With Alzheimers

The Bible is egalitarian in gender roles, not gender complementarian (as taught by CBMW), nor does the Bible teach that women cannot be preachers, leaders, or that they are to submit to a husband as though the husband were an authority figure. ((Link):Source)

The Bible does not condone or excuse husbands beating up their wives, but Pat Robertson gets into heresy on all this, and seems just fine with men beating their wives, and tries to make a joke out of it (see video clip below, linked).

Robertson also disturbingly compares a grown wife to little girls who rebels in one video segment; adult wives are not little girls.

Also bear in mind we don’t have the wife’s perspective of the marriage in all this, we only have the view of the disgruntled husband who wrote to Robertson for advice:

(Link – video on You Tube): Pat Robertson Tells Man to Beat his Wife, Move to Saudi Arabia

More un-biblical, anti family values comments and views from Robertson:

(Link): Ugly Wives Ruining Marriages says Pat Robertson

The Bible says that Christians are supposed to care for widows and orphans, but Robertson is anti-family values on this issue as well-

(Link): Pat Robertson’s Advice: Don’t Adopt Children

(Link): Pat Robertson: Don’t Adopt Sexually Molested Children, Could Grow Up “Weird”

See my previous posts:

(Link): Pat Robertson Expects Men to Commit Sexual Sin (and it’s not the first time) | (Robertson says Wives are to Blame if Husbands Commit Adultery)

My follow up post to that one:

(Link): Pat Robertson to married woman: All men are cheaters and sex crazed horn dogs, but that’s okay because they’re men

Here are some more links about Pat Roberton’s fornication:

(Link): Robertson’s Son Conceived Out of Wedlock

(Link): Wild Oats Robertson Rewrites His Resume (TIME, 1987)

    Only one week after Televangelist Pat Robertson formally declared his presidential candidacy, he received a chilling political baptism.

    Press accounts disclosed that Robertson’s first child had been conceived out of wedlock and that the former minister had misstated his wedding date to conceal the fact.

    Robertson, who has condemned sex before marriage, said he had merely tried to “protect his family” in previously suggesting that he had been married in March 1954 rather than on Aug. 27.

    Robertson’s first son was born ten weeks after the wedding. Robertson said that he and his wife Dede considered March 22, 1954 — the…

Robertson Assails Press Admits Backdated Wedding

Pat Robertson to married woman: All men are cheaters and sex crazed horn dogs, but that’s okay because they’re men

Pat Robertson to married woman: All men are cheaters, but that’s okay because they’re men

(Link): Yeah, remember my previous post:
Pat Robertson Expects Men to Commit Sexual Sin (and it’s not the first time)

Other sites carrying the same video:

(Link): Pat Robertson On Cheating Husband: ‘He’s A Man!’ (Video on You Tube)

(Link): Robertson: Husband Cheated But “Well, He’s A Man” (Video on You Tube)

Here’s the video (at least I think it’s the same thing I saw the other day):

Pat Robertson Expects Men to Commit Sexual Sin (and it’s not the first time)

Pat Robertson Expects Men to Commit Sexual Sin (and it’s not the first time)

Pat Robertson, evangelical host of the television show “The 700 Club,” was answering a viewer question about adultery on today’s (May 15, 2013) program, in the segment of the show called “Bring It On.”

The woman said her husband had an affair, and she was trying to forgive him but couldn’t move past it.

Robertson’s answer to this viewer is similar to previous ones he’s given, where he rationalizes and excuses the male’s sinful actions, and he continues to imply that men just can’t help it, gosh dang it, because males are wired to see a hot woman and get worked up over it, and they cannot resist.

Contra to Pat Robertson the Bible says something about the Holy Spirit giving each believer a measure of self-control, and in other New Testament passages, Paul talks about sexual behavior as though it is something that can be controlled by each believer; the Bible does not speak of sex as something that is beyond a person’s control or ability to avoid.

In his response to the married lady’s letter today, Robertson said (I am typing this from memory – though the first comment is a word- for- word quote of his; the rest are accurate paraphrases of his comments):

    “Well he’s a man, okay.”
    “Males have a tendency to wander a little bit and you have to make home as appealing as you can so he won’t want to cheat.”
    “The magazines are filled with salacious pictures of women”
    “Everywhere there are salacious temptatations to tempt a man.”

Robertson has taken a similar position in the past, when women write in to ask him why their husband is an alcoholic; a cheater; or what have you.

Robertson’s response is to blame the woman. In some situations, and despite not having a photo of the wife, and despite the letter writer not mentioning the appearance of the wife, Robertson assumes the wife is ugly and fat, and tells her men like pretty ladies, so the wife needs to lose weight and dress nice, that if only the wife would be skinny, pretty and non argumentative, she would not give her a husband a reason to be unfaithful, get drunk, or whatever.

I find it jaw dropping, very sexist, and incredible that Robertson keeps being so sexist.

A man is responsible for his own actions. It doesn’t matter if his wife is 800 pounds and toothless; that still would not give him a right to seek out a 25 year old 120 pound fashion model to start up a fling.

If you think about it, some of Robertson’s views are sexist against men.

I’d like to think at least some men on the planet are not so prone to, or easy to, caving in to sexual temptation, mistreating their wives or committing adultery, but he suggests men are helpless against their lusts or hormones, and a woman should just accept this as a fact of life.

By the way, this gets back to one theme I have been hammering away at on this blog for over a year:

One reason that there is so much sexual sin among Christians is that there is NO EXPECTATION THAT CHRISTIANS CAN OR WILL CONTROL SEXUAL BEHAVIOR.

It is continually ASSUMED and put forth by pastors, Christian authors on dating books, Christian blogs about dating, and by average lay persons, that sex is something that cannot be resisted or lived without.

Robertson’s quotes to his viewers that I have highlighted in this post is an example of what I mean. He is not the only one, however. I see other Christians, “every day Joe’s” around the web, who make similar comments: they feel they cannot live “X” number of days or months without sex.

Pastor Mark Driscoll of “Mars Hill” church frequently makes the same assumption in his speeches, blogs, or books about sex, dating, marriage: because he cannot picture himself living without sex for more than 3, 4 days in a row, he cannot conceive of any Christian being able to go long without sex.

And of course Driscoll is not the only one. If you look around the web long enough, on sites containing blogs by Christian pastors, or listen to their sermons on You Tube, or watch Christian talking heads on “TBN,” these assumptions come up over and over and over again.

As long as Christians keep buying into the secular premise that sex is a biological necessity that cannot be resisted, and preachers do not have an attitude of EXPECTATION that Christians can and will refrain from sex, we will keep seeing Christians, both married and single, committing sexual sin.

Update: Here’s the video (at least I think it’s the same thing I saw the other day):

Same video segment hosted here:

(Link): Robertson: Husband Cheated But “Well, He’s A Man” (Video on You Tube)

Continue reading “Pat Robertson Expects Men to Commit Sexual Sin (and it’s not the first time)”

Christian Response FAIL to Sexual Sin – Easy Forgivism

Christian Response FAIL to Sexual Sin – Easy Forgivism

On a recent episode of the Christian program “The 700 Club,” someone wrote in to their (Link): “Bring It On” segment to say she had an extra- marital affair, and her spouse divorced her as a result. She wants to know how to move on.

Basically, the host, Pat Robertson, said that she should forgive herself. He made some sort of remark about how we are all “sexual beings” and may slip into sexual sin from time to time-it’s totally expected and normal to commit sexual sin, he seemed to be saying.

While I am not advocating that this adulteress beat herself up over her sexual sin for the rest of her life, or that the church should line up to toss stones at her, I found Robertson’s tone, comments, and attitude about adultery a little too dismissive of sexual sin.

There was this underlying vibe in his reaction that all humans are going to slip and literally sin sexually (ie, actually engage in physical acts, not just engage in sexual fantasy). However, this is simply not true.

There are some Christians who remain virgins past their 20s. It is a very damaging assumption and fallacy to keep suggesting, as evangelicals, Neo Calvinists, Baptists, and fundamentalists do, that nobody can resist sexual desires for years or forever. People can in fact resist giving in to sexual desires and acting upon them- but they choose not to.

If God is so easy peasy to look past sexual sins, including in the case of adultery as Robertson is claiming, and if sliding into sexual acts outside of marriage is totally normal and to be expected, why should I remain sexually pure at my age (I’m over 40)? There is no reason to.
———————
Related post(s) this blog

(Link): Christians and Cheap Grace Concerning Sexual Sin

(Link):  Some Researchers Argue that Shame Should Be Used to Treat Sexual Compulsions

Bay-Bees – Have Lots of Them (Addendum)

(Addendum to previous post):
“Bay-Bees – Have them, have lots of them and NOW, no matter what!, say some Christians”

I meant to include this in my previous post on this topic but forgot to (someone left me a response in that thread disagreeing with me, and I left her a response). Anyway….

A woman wrote in to Pat Robertson’s show the other day, The 700 Club, to ask if she should permit her daughter to stay in the same bed as her boyfriend when they come over for a visit.

Robertson then got into this tangent where he said, “Marriage is for making babies.”
(Or, he might have said, “Marriage is for pro-creation.” I forget the exact wording of his remark, whether he used the term “babies” or “pro creation,” but he did say, “that [babies / pro creation] is the purpose of marriage.”

I don’t recall any biblical passages stating that the sole reason for marriage is to have babies. (I don’t even remember any verses saying it’s the primary reason – but perhaps it’s in there, and I just forgot.)

I think a lot of conservative Christians – the ones who have made idols out of marriage and having children, and the more extreme patriarchy- type lunatic “Quiverfull” groups – tend to stretch verses such as “be fruitful and multiply” to apply in situations where they do not, or are not, for all Christians for all times in all situations.

I would dare say since God presented Eve to Adam after having said, “it is not good for man to be alone” that one primary reason for the existence of marriage is for companionship. Not baby-making, but for companionship.

Sure, baby-making might be ONE reason for the creation of marriage by God, but it’s not the ONLY reason, as Robertson implied in his response.

This bizarre obsession with marriage and cranking out babies is one reason why so many people, Christian and Non, feel so unwelcomed or alienated from churches, or why they stop going.

People, including Christian people, who are childless, child-free, never-married, or widowed are frequently over-looked by most American Christianity.

The never-married (over the age of 30), the child free, the childless, and the widowers – their needs are dismissed or never acknowledged to start with. They are not usually mentioned from the pulpit, or on mainstream Christian blogs, in magazines, or in most Christian books about relationships.

Most attention by conservative Christians is spent hand-wringing over and worrying about the decline of marriage, the decline of the U.S. birth rate, complaining about the Democrats, or complaining about the legalization of homosexual marriage.

As for the hand wringing about the decline of marriage by conservative Christians, it is highly hypocritical of them to do this.

When older, never-married Christians ask for help from their Christian communities to get married (“please help me get a spouse! Introduce me to some great singles, or create more singles functions where we can meet and mingle”), they are scolded and lectured and get comments such as… THEY, the singles who desire marriage, are

  • “making an idol of marriage”
  • “be content in your singleness, it’s a gift!”

  • “we can’t turn the singles group into a meat market, it’s for Bible study ONLY”
  • “God may have called you to life long singleness”

-and older unmarried Christians get other such un-helpful comments like those.

Note to churches and preachers:
If you want the marriage rate among Christians to sky rocket, get off your asses and start helping Christian singles, who are ages 30+, to meet other Christian singles so that they can date and then marry. Provide practical assistance in this area.

Anyway, I don’t see any biblical grounds for thinking that making a baby is the sole, or primary, purpose of marriage.

Conflicting Message to Christian Women by Christians About Physical Appearance

Conflicting Message to Christian Women by Christians About Physical Appearance

I plan on making a longer post later about how Christian dating and marriage advice often emphasizes the supposed necessity of the importance of a woman’s physical appearance – and how annoying this emphasis is – but this post, I wanted to keep this post a little short.

On the one hand, going back decades now, conservative American churches and other Christian entities have instructed unmarried women that if they want dates or a husband, they have to stay thin and attractive at all times.

This is the type of advice I would expect to see in secular sources pertaining to dating, and it is in fact often mentioned in secular sources, but it’s disappointing to see it on Christian sites, magazines, and so forth, but it is.

We Christian women get told repeatedly in Christian publications, blogs, radio shows, TV shows, and sermons, that Christian men -(really? This sounds more like it would be more true of secular men)- prefer sexy hotty totty sexy sexy women. Ergo, we Christian women must be clones of sex pot movie star Megan Fox or Jayne Mansfield at all times, until we die. We are not allowed to age, get wrinkles, or facial lines.

(By the way, this extreme, sexist, and unfair fixation on a woman’s looks has earned this topic the tag of “Lookism” on this blog, so if you want to see other posts, past or future, where I discuss this, please see the “Lookism” tag off to the side bar of this blog.)

Some pastors or Christian spokespersons, such as Mark Driscoll and Pat Robertson (see this post at this blog for more on that), have said that if a married man cheats on his wife (or is an alcoholic), it is totally understandable, reasonable, or expected, if the wife has “let herself go.” Married men have a right to cheat on their wife if their wife has gained weight or gotten wrinkles, is the implied message from these so-called Christian speakers.

Please, someone, point me to the Bible passage that says, “Thou shall not commit adultery, unless thy wife has gotten overweight, wrinkles, sags, or grey hair, in which case, I, your most Holy God, am all like, ‘Bro, I totally understand-eth! Thou art excused from the whole adultery thing.'”

So anyway, we women are told -indoctrinated and brainwashed constantly- since our youth, that our value as Christian women resides not in God, but in being quiet, submissive, and PRETTY (and as we get older, the characteristics of “being a wife and a mommy” are added), but BEING PRETTY is always on the list.

That message is obnoxious in and of itself, but what gets my goat is that it’s also frequently brandished along side this next sexist chestnut which conflicts with it; here it is:

Christian ladies, don’t be sexy because it might cause your “brothers in Christ” to “stumble.”

On the one hand, we Christian ladies are pressured to remain sexy, thin, and attractive, lest we turn off our husbands (if we have one), or, for those of us desiring marriage, lest we repel the single men out there, but, we should not look sexy because it might cause a man to have naughty, lustful thoughts.

So, according to a lot of conservative Christian authors, television hosts, and bloggers, I’m supposed to look sexy but not look sexy.
(Please click the “read more” link to read the rest of this post. Thanks)

Continue reading “Conflicting Message to Christian Women by Christians About Physical Appearance”

Bay-Bees – Have them, have lots of them and NOW, no matter what say some Christians

Bay-Bees – Have them, have lots of them and NOW, no matter what!, say some Christians Please see Part 2 of This Post

I was watching Pat Robertson today – by the way, I don’t always mean to single this guy out. A lot of his views about marriage, gender roles, babies, and other issues are similar to those of other male preachers and Christian talking heads.

Sooo. On a previous broadcast, Pat Robertson advised his Christian viewers to “out breed” their “opponents” (by which he meant Muslims, but I also suspect he was thinking of atheists, liberals, and other groups). You can read this post here at this blog for more about that.

Based on figures I have seen in books and blogs, currently about 50% of the American population is unmarried – this is also true of conservative Christians, 50% are unmarried. This includes never married, divorced, widowed.

It seems strange to me that Robertson and other Christian spokespersons and preachers keep insisting that Christians have more kids. About 20% of married couples do not have children, and who knows why that is. Maybe they have infertility issues, don’t want any, or can’t afford one.

When about 50% of American Christians are single, you’re asking the other 50% to crank out a lot of kids, and some of those 50% might be people over 40, 50, or 60 and don’t have the physical ability, energy, or health to keep up with a kid.

Your 50% of unmarried people technically are not supposed to be having sex. I know it’s popular to question this in some quarters – some Christians on other blogs actually argue that the Bible, and God, are fine and hunky-dory with fornication (sexual activity outside of marriage).

But no, God is not hunky-dory and okay with fornication- that fact is alluded to in many verses. In the Old Testament days, if a woman was not a virgin on her wedding night, she was to be stoned to death, if I recall correctly. She had to bring proof to the priests, via stained bridal sheets (sorry to be a bit crass, but it’s in the Scriptures), that she was a virgin on her wedding night, should her new husband claim she was not.

Obviously, since Christ, God has dropped the “stone her to death” routine, or whatever the penalty was at the time, but the fact that God called for a severe penalty at some point in history for fornication should be a huge CLUE that He is not “okay” with sex outside of marriage – HELLO.

I just find it really insulting, stupid, or unrealistic that some conservative Christians are bemoaning and fretting the decline of child birth among Christians. I can’t quite articulate it.

Maybe it’s because I’m over 40 years old and have never been married but wanted to be married that I find this annoying – that, and I also don’t think it’s anyone’s place to tell married couples when or how to have a baby. The Bible does not COMMAND all married couples to breed like rabbits, the “be fruitful” comment aside – I have never understood that “be fruitful” comment to be an iron-clad COMMANDMENT to all married couples forever, that they MUST follow or be damned by God.

These weenie TV preachers are asking Christian women to pop out more babies. I couldn’t pop out more kids if I wanted to, unless I went against biblical teachings about fornication and had a kid out of wedlock. Is that what the Pat Robertsons of the nation really want?
Continue reading “Bay-Bees – Have them, have lots of them and NOW, no matter what say some Christians”

Conservatives and Christians Fretting About U.S. Population Decline – We Must “Out-breed” Opponents Christian Host Says

Conservatives and Christians Fretting About U.S. Population Decline – We Must “Out-breed” Opponents Christian Host Says

I’m right in the middle of writing a post on another topic for this blog when the hosts of the Christian program “The 700 Club” announced they will be interviewing a male author, Jonathan V. Last, of a book called “What to Expect When No One’s Is Expecting: America’s Coming Demographic Disaster.”

This was preceded by a journalist on the show doing a brief news segment high-lighting that birth rates for 20-something American women have declined, while births for ages 35 – 44 American women have increased.

I never cared strongly if I had children or not. I wanted marriage, but kids? I didn’t care strongly about having children. That’s my personal position on the kid issue.

I am watching the interview now, as it’s airing.

The author at least concedes that it’s okay if people choose not to have kids. Host Pat Robertson isn’t fully on board with that view.

Now Last, the author, is going on to say what disasters will befall America if women don’t pop out two point five kids each – not enough tax payers to support medicare, it becomes difficult to sustain defense (not enough 18 year olds to join the military), and so forth.

Robertson is now asking the author, Last, about declining population in Japan (and later, he asks about Germany).

Continue reading “Conservatives and Christians Fretting About U.S. Population Decline – We Must “Out-breed” Opponents Christian Host Says”

Creepy, Creepy and Sexist Pat Robertson

In the future, I plan on doing a post where I will reference this one. For now, here is a collection of links about creepy and sexist things Robertson has said.

I made a post about Pat Roberton’s creepy behavior the other day (here: “Is Pat Robertson of The 700 Club Show some kind of secret perv? He’s Creepy”).

Links (click the “read more” link below to see the rest of the links, and some excerpts):

Awful-Looking Women to Blame For Marital Problems, Pat Robertson Feels

Pat Robertson ‘Shocked’ That Women Watch Porn, Enjoy Erotic Novels Like ‘Fifty Shades Of Grey’ (VIDEO)

Slatternly-looking wives ruining marriages, says Pat Robertson

Pat Robertson Talks Porn, Makes Everyone Uncomfortable [VIDEO]

Continue reading “Creepy, Creepy and Sexist Pat Robertson”

Is Pat Robertson of The 700 Club Show some kind of secret perv? He’s Creepy

So I was watching Pat Robertson hosting the TV show “The 700 Club” show interview a woman (last name Flores) who was caught in a sex traffic ring years ago.  (You can watch/ read her interview online (Link:) here.)

I was not not paying close attention to this interview until one point, where Robertson happened to begin grilling the woman (who wrote a book about her experience called “A Slave Across The Street”), about specific details about her ordeals as a teen-aged sex slave.

Robertson actually asked her questions such as, ‘did the men use objects to penetrate you?’, and he felt the need to mention specifics, such as, “so the men had you bound hand and foot on a bed, spread eagle, where they raped you and then slapped you…”-  etc.

Really, I don’t think it’s necessary to go into extreme details on a so-called Christian show that airs at 9 AM, 2 PM, 10 PM during the day, to give us an idea of the hellish nature of her situation.

One reason I found Robertson’s prurient interest creepy is that he did find it so interesting.

He seemed to be titillated or entertained by her sexual attacks. (Please click the “read more” link below to read the rest of this post)

Continue reading “Is Pat Robertson of The 700 Club Show some kind of secret perv? He’s Creepy”

Topics Preachers Should or Shouldn’t Mention When Discussing Singlehood

Here are a few suggestions as to what I think Christian pastors and Christian talk show hosts should (or should not) preach or discuss when addressing Christian singlehood.*

Sex, Sex, Sex and More Sex

I think sex is one topic that Christian pastors need to stay away from when talking to or about singlehood, or they need to stop lecturing about it as often as they do.

Anytime pastors or Christian personalities (such as people who host Christian television shows) do bother to address singles (usually they’re fixated on married life, unfortunately), it’s usually nothing more than to issue dire warnings about not giving in to sexual sin.

Continue reading “Topics Preachers Should or Shouldn’t Mention When Discussing Singlehood”