Those “God Brought Me My Spouse” Stories – Woman Says God Brought Her A Spouse on the Beach

Those “God Brought Me My Spouse” Stories – Woman Says God Brought Her A Spouse on the Beach

I’m really not supportive of these types of stories, the type that you see below.

When I was a teen and in my 20s, I would read Christian books and magazine articles. Every so often, I’d see an author claim that God answered her prayers by sending her a Christian spouse.

Now that I’m in my 40s and still not married – in spite of having faith and praying since youth that God would send me a great guy – I think these stories are fanciful and that they are aberrations.

I’m leaning more towards the opinion now that if you want to get married, it’s up to you to make it happen – by going to bars, asking friends to fix you up, going on dating sites – rather than expecting God to make it happen.

So, I find stories like the ones below misleading.

(Link):  Chance meeting on beach leads to marriage with godly man

– – Sunday, July 30, 2017

Thirty-four years ago this month, I was fresh out of college and earnestly seeking God’s will in my life. My heart was hungry for a godly man of outstanding character.

And though I had decided that compromise in this most critical of relationships was not an option, I was beginning to doubt whether a man of that quality could possibly exist, or if I would ever find him.

Little did I know that God already had set his answer to my prayers into motion.

Continue reading “Those “God Brought Me My Spouse” Stories – Woman Says God Brought Her A Spouse on the Beach”

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Maryland Pastor Pushes Equally Yoked Doctrine – Which Only Promotes Unwanted Protracted Singleness

Maryland Pastor Pushes Equally Yoked Doctrine – Which Only Promotes Unwanted Protracted Singleness

This is a nauseating page by a pastor in Maryland, named Sean Nolan, for the “Desiring God” web site. (You can see the link below.)

I will comment more about this guy’s essay BELOW it. So please scroll down for some of my commentary – most of which you can already guess if you’ve been to my blog before and have seen my previous posts about this “Equally Yoked” stuff.

(Link): Letter to a Friend Engaged to a Nonbeliever by Sean Nolan

Excerpts from the page:

Dear Kelly,

I was surprised by the recent news of your engagement. While I wish I could celebrate with you without reservation, I admit I have some. My greatest concern is that your fianceé does not know or love Christ. Because I love you and care about your future, I feel compelled to speak now rather than to hold my peace, knowing full well how you might receive my “peace.”

…As I have watched people walk down this road, I have noticed several common ways people justify marrying a nonbeliever. I want to address them…

Continue reading “Maryland Pastor Pushes Equally Yoked Doctrine – Which Only Promotes Unwanted Protracted Singleness”

The Stupid Billy Graham Rule Strikes Again, Via Relevant Magazine: ‘Is It OK for Married People to Text the Opposite Sex?,’ by Z. Carter

The Stupid Billy Graham Rule Strikes Again, Via Relevant Magazine: Is It OK for Married People to Text the Opposite Sex?, by Z. Carter

Not only did Relevant magazine (Christian publication) recently publish this dreck (link is much farther down this blog post), but a guy or two under Relevant’s Tweet about it were defending it, LOL.

This is basically a variation on the BGR (Billy Graham Rule), which generally casts singles as harlots, women in particular. Ergo, married men are strongly cautioned against talking to, showing compassion to, being around, taking phone calls from, adult single women.

(I have a collection of posts on my blog that refutes the BGR; please see links to those posts at the bottm of this one, under “Related Posts.”)

Jesus never taught the BGR, but actually befriended and talked to all sorts of women, including known prostitutes, divorced women, and so on.

Do evangelicals and the Reformed emulate Jesus on this, Jesus being the role model for all believers? Nope – they choose to emulate the rule-loving Pharisees who also taught men that all women are sexual temptresses, so men ought to avert their gaze if they see a woman walking by.

This paranoia of opposite-gender friendships ends up ostracizing and excluding single adults (some of whom may be lonely and in great need of platonic companionship, let alone romantic), it basically casts even virgins such as myself (over the age of 40) as being hookers and sluts, and it sexualizes every one.

For about four years now, I’ve been Facebook friends with a married guy on Facebook. He knows I’m single. I know he’s married. He knows I know he’s married.

I’ve also been friends with another married guy online for about ten or more years (we met on a forum) and we later became Facebook friends. This guy knows I know he’s married, and he knows I’m single.

And do you know what? This has not been a problem for any of us!

I sometimes even send private notes to the first friend on Facebook about some of my personal problems (stuff I don’t want to put on my Facebook wall).  At no time have I flirted with either male friend, nor have they flirted with me. It’s not even entered my mind!

Yes, it’s possible for single women to be pals with married dudes and nothing inappropriate happens.

I was engaged several years to a guy. My ex at one point rented his own home, then he went on to two different apartments.

I sometimes spent the night with him at these places (over night stays) even in the SAME BED, and we did NOT have sex. (I was very committed to the idea of remaining a virgin until marriage at that point in life. So, my ex and I did not have sex). It’s possible for two adults to spend time alone over night and not have sex.

I have a libido. My ex let me know he had one too – he respected my wishes and boundaries, but he let me know on more than one occasion he was “warm for my form” and was very tempted to get it on. However, we both had self control. Just because you’re alone with someone else and find them attractive does not mean that sex is inevitable.

At least several of the people who left comments below this page (on the Relevant site) were critical of the piece:

(Link):  Is It OK for Married People to Text the Opposite Sex? by Zack Carter

Excerpts.

Affairs don’t start with sex.

….However, I probably don’t have to tell you that too much can be dangerous—especially privacy with someone of the opposite sex.

Continue reading “The Stupid Billy Graham Rule Strikes Again, Via Relevant Magazine: ‘Is It OK for Married People to Text the Opposite Sex?,’ by Z. Carter”

Alpha Females Part 1 – Nothing New Under the Sun. Conservative Women Keep Issuing Same Sexist, Unhelpful Dating And Marital Advice to Women

Alpha Females Part 1 – Nothing New Under the Sun. Conservative Women Keep Issuing Same Sexist, Unhelpful Dating And Marital Advice to Women

This commentary will be divided up among a few posts. Here is part 1.

Visit Part 2 | Part 3 |  A Response to Venker: Re: Personal Experience

Part 4

Introduction.

For those new to my blog:

I am a right winger. I was a Republican until recently. I am now a conservative Independent.

I was a conservative Christian for many years (I am no longer sure about what my religious views are), and I (Link): Am A Former Gender Complementarian (someone who believed in and lived out traditional gender roles, views which are based in large measure on incorrect interpretations and applications about gender in the Bible).

I sometimes agree with secular left wing feminists on some topics, but not always. At times, I disagree with secular and religious left wing feminists and have written several blog posts critiquing some of their views.


This series of posts is addressing author Suzanne Venker’s relationship advice, as I have seen her advocate for, in behalf of her book “The Alpha Female’s Guide to Men and Marriage.”

I myself am not, nor have I ever been, what she terms an “Alpha Female.”

I have always been what she refers to as a “Beta,” and guess what?

Being a Beta did not land me a spouse, dates, or make my life easier, more peaceful, less stressful, or rewarding, as Venker tries to reassure her female readers that it will. More on that in a future post.

As a conservative who is in her 40s and still single (though engaged at one time), I have been seeing these sorts of attitudes about gender and marriage that are discussed below in an article by Venker advanced by secular and religious conservatives since I was a teen in the 1980s.

There is an annoying, recurrent, and yes, sexist, motiff by conservatives to say the reason society has problems with marriage, dating irregularity, high divorce rates, and other relationship problems – is that women are at fault.

Women are always blamed for relationship trends and problems – and at that, usually by other women – and at that, by women who tend to be conservative and who publish books or articles about dating and marriage.

Continue reading “Alpha Females Part 1 – Nothing New Under the Sun. Conservative Women Keep Issuing Same Sexist, Unhelpful Dating And Marital Advice to Women”

Women: Stop Asking Pat Robertson For Romantic Relationship Advice

Women: Stop Asking Pat Robertson For Romantic Relationship Advice – Whether You Are Divorced or Single 


Aug 16, 2016 edit: Just a few days after I made this post imploring women to stop asking Robertson for romantic relationship advice, Robertson did this:

(Link):  Christian TV Show Pat Robertson Says Wives Who Want Emotional Support from a Husband Are Immature and Should Not Expect Emotional Support

Then Robertson turned around and did this – November 2016 edit:

(Link): Pat Robertson’s Incredibly Insensitive Advice to Gail the Unmarried Woman 

Yep. This is why I beg you, women of the world: stop going to Pat Robertson with dating, singleness, divorce, or marriage questions! You are not going to get valuable advice or empathy for your problems, but a lot of victim-blaming and shaming.


So, yesterday (August 2, 2016), on the TV show “The 700 Club,” Christian host Pat Robertson fielded a question from some woman who wrote in saying she had been divorced four times (I placed two videos of that segment in this post, towards the end).

If I understand the woman’s letter correctly, she says she accepted Christ as her savior, or turned to God, after her fourth divorce.

She said her first four husbands were abusive. She wants to know, now that she has rededicated her life to God, will God send her a loving husband?

Look, I knew before Pat ever opened his mouth how he would answer this woman. And I cringed in anticipation. And I was right about his reply.

I’ve watched The 700 Club every single day since the year 2005, and off and on prior to that. My mother used to watch his show when I was a kid, so I was exposed to it back then. I suppose I still watch it out of habit.

I have seen so many episodes of this show, I already can tell you how Robertson is going to answer before he opens his mouth, and I am correct about 90% of the time (regarding relationship questions he receives).

More often than not, if you are a woman and you write Pat Robertson for relationship advice, especially if you have been divorced, he will most likely blame you. He will tell you that you have a “failed relationship picker” and you should stay single.  He figures that since you have failed at marriage once or twice before, there is little sense in trying again, because you will only fail again.

Robertson will shame and blame you for having married abusers, duds, and losers.

Robertson is also not kind to single women over 40 who have never married but who would like to marry.

Continue reading “Women: Stop Asking Pat Robertson For Romantic Relationship Advice”

How Churches Ruin Dating – via Relevant

How Churches Ruin Dating – via Relevant

Many churches coach married women in abusive marriage to stay with their abusive spouses: please remember that the next time you hear Christians spouting off dating advice.

Never take dating advice into consideration if it is being doled out by people who think a wife should “submit” to an abusive husband, which most (gender complementarian) Christians believe.

I am not saying that the woman who wrote this page I am linking to below feels that way – I’m not sure what her views are about gender complementarianism or domestic abuse – I am only speaking in general terms.

(Link): How Churches Ruin Dating – via Relevant by K. Wilkinson

Excerpts:

  • If you’ve dated in the Christian circle for any length of time, you, too, probably have humorous stories as well as scars. As there’s no book in the Bible with a dating how-to, the “biblical dating” we strive for actually doesn’t exist—we’ve been left to our own devices to figure it out. And churches haven’t always done the best job helping us get there.
  • Like many parts of faith, Christian dating culture is home to many double standards. We encourage women to keep high standards and desire only the godliest of men, yet we pity the “forever alone” single women who seemingly received a lifetime supply of the “gift” of singleness.
  • We encourage men to pursue women, to be forward with their intentions, yet when a guy has asked too many women to coffee in the same church circle, we label him “desperate.”

Continue reading “How Churches Ruin Dating – via Relevant”

Preacher Perry Noble Gives Advice to Adult Singles On How To Date and Marry Days Before Articles Say He’s Having Marriage Problems – Consider the Source

Preacher Perry Noble Gives Advice to Adult Singles On How To Date and Marry Days Before Articles Say He’s Having Marriage Problems – Consider the Source

As I’ve said before, Consider the Source when listening to dating advice.

On July 6th, Christian Post published a page with dating advice by pastor Perry Noble.

On July 8th, Christian Post published an article suggesting that Noble may have been fired from his church for, among other things, marital problems.

Why is a guy who is in the midst of having marital issues writing dating advice for singles? Please. Does the phoniness in contemporary Evangelical Land know no limits?

From what I’ve seen on the internet the last two, three days, Noble’s church is expected to announce tomorrow that he was fired, probably due to marital conflicts or alcoholism or something.

Continue reading “Preacher Perry Noble Gives Advice to Adult Singles On How To Date and Marry Days Before Articles Say He’s Having Marriage Problems – Consider the Source”

Women, Stop Listening to Sexist Relationship ‘Experts’ by D. L. D’Oyley

Women, Stop Listening to Sexist Relationship ‘Experts’ by D. L. D’Oyley

If you are not already aware, Steve Harvey, whom this author discusses, is a Christian. He is sometimes a guest speaker on Christian network TBN.

(Link): Women, Stop Listening to Sexist Relationship ‘Experts’ (page 1) (Link to Page 2) by D. L. D’Oyley

Excerpts:

  • Feb 2016
  • She Matters: If they’re men who hold shoddy views about sex and women, it follows that their advice to women will also be shoddy.
  • …It’s a common theme among men, including many so-called relationship experts. And that’s a huge problem.
  • It should be obvious why that’s an issue, but in case it isn’t: You have men who hold screwed-up views about sex and women telling women how to be better women to land a man.
  • If the perspective with which they view women is shoddy, then it follows that their advice to women will also be shoddy.

Continue reading “Women, Stop Listening to Sexist Relationship ‘Experts’ by D. L. D’Oyley”

Pro-Rape Pastor Defends Church’s Hiring of Child Rapist – Adult Singles: Dump the Equally Yoked Teaching

Pro-Rape Pastor Defends Church’s Hiring of Child Rapist – Adult Singles: Dump the Equally Yoked Teaching

I spotted this link (shared farther down page) when it was shared on WatchKeep’s Twitter today. My blog is not about child sexual abuse per se. I tend to focus, most often, on issues surrounding adult singleness.

If you are an adult Christian single who wants to be married, please reconsider following the “Be equally yoked” teaching. Whether or not the guy in this news story I have in this blog post is a “true” Christian or not is beside the point.

You can date a Christian man who you believe to be a “true” Christian – maybe you met him at church (which is pretty rare because single males do not attend churches), or maybe you met him on a Christian dating site (which some Christian men have used to select rape victims), and he shows all the outward signs of “loving the Lord” and so on and so forth – but then it is revealed he is a child rapist.

Would you really want to discover the guy you married is a child rapist, or views child porn?

I also question the pastor of this church who is defending the child rapist: could you imagine marrying a preacher, who you would assume is a godly man, only to find out he blames child rape victims for having been raped?

Also be aware that pedophiles actively seek wife material at churches. That’s right, single Christian lady: some guy who is a pedophile may start flirting with you at church or in Sunday School, hoping you will date and marry him. I did (Link): a post about this several days ago.

(Link):  Pro-Rape Pastor Defends Church’s Hiring of Child Rapist

Excerpt:

  • April 15, 2016
  • A Kentucky pastor is defending the decision to allow a convicted sex offender [Thomas Hopper] to work at his church [Truth Apostolic Church].
  • … Hopper was convicted of rape and sodomy of a 13-year-old girl in the early 1990s, followed by multiple criminal convictions in the early 2000s.  …

Continue reading “Pro-Rape Pastor Defends Church’s Hiring of Child Rapist – Adult Singles: Dump the Equally Yoked Teaching”

Christian Blogger About Divorce, Pastor Andrew Webb, Thinks All To Most Mid-Life Never – Married or Single – Again Adults Are Mal-Adjusted, Ugly Losers Who Have Too Much Baggage

Christian Blogger About Divorce, Pastor Andrew Webb, Thinks All To Most Mid-Life Never – Married or Single – Again Adults Are Mal-Adjusted, Ugly Losers Who Have Too Much Baggage

Holy guacamole did I ever find a post by a Christian guy who really knows how to slam never-married or “single again” adults.

I was astounded by parts of this guy’s post.

I almost re-tweeted a link to his blog post about divorce from my Twitter page (I saw someone else share it on Twitter), thinking someone may find it helpful (judging from the title alone, it sounded like it might be a good page) but thankfully, I skimmed it first.

I left a reply under the guy’s post, and his blog says my post is awaiting moderation. Who knows if he will approve it to appear or not.

(August 2016 update: my comment on his blog, that I made in April 2016, is STILL tagged with the “awaiting moderation” comment on his blog. Unreal.)

I have copied in my reply farther below. I tried to be civil in my reply.

I’m going to try to be charitable here on my own blog: maybe this guy does not realize how deeply insulting his blog post is – the parts where he talks about divorced people or the never-married.

This guy should realize that upholding marriage or discouraging divorce does not necessitate INSULTING SINGLE PEOPLE.

You do not have to scare married people out of divorce by suggesting that all “single again” or never-married adults out there are great big, scary losers who have a lot of baggage, so if married people divorce, they won’t be able to find a great partner.

Continue reading “Christian Blogger About Divorce, Pastor Andrew Webb, Thinks All To Most Mid-Life Never – Married or Single – Again Adults Are Mal-Adjusted, Ugly Losers Who Have Too Much Baggage”

Complementarian Churches and the Single Adult Woman by J. Dyer

Complementarian Churches and the Single Adult Woman by J. Dyer

This is a page by a woman in her mid 30s who thought she would have been married by now but still finds herself single. She describes how the gender complementarian churches she has attended don’t minister to adult single women properly.

She also notes in this page how following all the usual Christian dating advice has not worked – she’s tried it all and is still single; this is a phenomenon I’ve blogged about before.

(Link): Complementarian Churches and the Single Adult Woman by J. Dyer

Excerpts:

  • …But it [meeting a spouse at church] didn’t [happen]. Well-meaning friends told me all manner of things about how God must be teaching me something (it appears I’m a slow learner). Or–my favorite–if I could just delight in the Lord, when I least expected it, God would bring “the man” into my life.
  • Churches often try to tell women how to be women without considering the whole range of God-inspired possibilities. There will always be outliers to the model they create.

Continue reading “Complementarian Churches and the Single Adult Woman by J. Dyer”

Pedophiles Seeking Christian Wives in Churches – Another Reason to be Leery of the “Equally Yoked” Idea and Reconsider Church as a Place to Meet Singles

Pedophiles Seeking Christian Wives in Churches – Another Reason to be Leery of the “Equally Yoked” Idea and Reconsider Church as a Place to Meet Singles

I skimmed over this really long blog post, on Brent Detwiler’s site (link much farther below), about a guy, Caffery, who was jailed for pedophilia. Caffery has more than one victim, if I remember right.

Caffery wrote a book at one point claiming that belief in Christ changed his life for the better, and so on and so forth (amazingly, he was molesting kids while writing this book – during the same time frame).

Caffery also wrote (in a book or a letter to his church elders, I forget which) that he was afraid if his wife gave birth to a daughter, he would molest his own daughter, so he prayed and asked God for sons. His wife went on to give birth to all sons. (I think the blog post says he later had a daughter by his second wife.)

Let me pause here to say: if I were dating or engaged to a guy who told me this upfront, that he is afraid he might molest any kids we had together, I would take him at his word and dump his ass.

(I don’t know if the woman this guy married knew beforehand or not, I’m just saying if this happened to me, I would NOT stay with a guy who confessed such a thing to me.

Never, ever stay with a guy out of pity or a sense of duty – don’t feel sorry for Mr. “I might molest our kids if we have kids together” Pervert. Helping him or redeeming such a deviant is not your responsibility. Part of the reason I got sucked into my last disaster of an engagement was that I felt sorry for the guy.)

The part that really stood out to me in this blog post by DeWiler was when Caffery said after one wife divorced him, he went looking for a new wife at a large Christian church. I found this alarming and creepy.

Continue reading “Pedophiles Seeking Christian Wives in Churches – Another Reason to be Leery of the “Equally Yoked” Idea and Reconsider Church as a Place to Meet Singles”

Women Are Still Being Told To Lower Their Standards / Stupid Sh*t People Say to Singles by S. H. Weiss

Women Are Still Being Told To Lower Their Standards / Stupid Sh*t People Say to Singles by S. H. Weiss

One thing the author of this page brings up is something I have as well: women are just as visually oriented as men are and do care about what men look like. However, women are conditioned by secular society and religious groups to think they should not care about a man’s physical attractiveness.

Women are conditioned to look past a man’s ugliness to consider his other traits – is he smart, financially stable, and so on.

Now, I do think some people are in fact way too judgmental or picky regarding physical appearance in dating or whom to marry.

But, on the other hand, there is absolutely nothing wrong in wanting to date or marry someone you consider attractive. I don’t think people of either gender should be super picky about looks, but it’s okay to have some preferences or standards.

The woman who wrote this says she caught some guy she knew lying in his dating site profile – he was 35 years old but claimed on his dating profile he is 25 or 30 years old. She asked him why he lied about his age.

He claims it’s because he wants to start a family and a woman in her 20s is guaranteed to be fertile.

First of all, women in their 40s (and 30s) still menstruate and get pregnant, so you don’t need to marry a 20 something to have babies. Some women in their 20s are childfree or infertile.

Secondly, as I noted before, I advised single women who read this blog to lie on their dating site profiles about their ages, to make themselves younger than they are.

As so many men are this very shallow and particular about age in a woman (many of them have a cut off age of 29, while for others, it’s about 35), go ahead and cite yourself as being 20 or 30 something on your profile if you are over 40 and want dates.

The worst thing that will happen once the guy gets to know you after he meets you via a dating site is that he will decide to stop dating you. Big whoop.

I have seen or read about a lot of men ages 45 and older who lie about their ages on dating sites. I’ve had guys who are obviously 65 or older (they have all white hair) who contact me on dating sites, who claim to be 41 or 42 years old. Men lie out the ass about their ages (and their height, according to other women) all the time on these sites.

(Link):  Liberated Shmiberated!: Women are Still Being Told to Lower Their Standards (& it’s messed up!) by S. H. Weiss

Excerpts:

  • February 2016
  • …It is Traister’s message that I would like to share with the women I have spoken with lately, women who feel they need to defend themselves to others about why they are not married, why they are not “just settling down already” and why they are “being too picky.”
  • The women I speak of range from early 30s to early 40s. Some of them have never been married, while others were married briefly. A third of them are divorced and have children. The one thing these friends have in common is that they all say that are not “single by choice.” They express the desire to find their perfect life partner.
  • ..However, there are Yentas everywhere, some well-intentioned and others questionably motivated. This is especially true for those who are part of a tight-knit or religious community (ranging from the Mormons to the Modern Orthodox Jewish).

Continue reading “Women Are Still Being Told To Lower Their Standards / Stupid Sh*t People Say to Singles by S. H. Weiss”

Eight Pieces of Christian Dating Advice that is Keeping Me Single. by Nina Borum – from Stuff Christians Like.net

Eight Pieces of Christian Dating Advice that is Keeping Me Single. – from Stuff Christians Like.net

(Link):  Eight 8 pieces of Christian dating advice that is keeping me single. by Nina Borum

Excerpts:

  • ….but I have taken all the advice below and find that I am still single.
  • 4. God’s timing is perfect.
  • Is it? According to abcnews.com women lose 90% of their eggs by age 30.
    Chop Chop Jesus. Chop Chop.

Continue reading “Eight Pieces of Christian Dating Advice that is Keeping Me Single. by Nina Borum – from Stuff Christians Like.net”

A Dating Video in Light of Being Equally Yoked Teaching

A Dating Video in Light of Being Equally Yoked Teaching

Facebook group  SCCL (Stuff Christian Culture Likes) posted a link to this video a few days back

I’ve watched the video, but I didn’t pay close attention to it. Several of the guys mentioned they wanted a “girl” who would be servant-minded – what, so they can serve these guys, bring them their beer and slippers when they get home from work? Bleh and puke.

Some of the guys in the video also mentioned wanting a girl who “dresses modestly.”

Someone on SCCL named, Elizabeth Burger, typed up a transcript of the video:

Transcript complete (typed by E. Burger):
[Three or Four Young Christian men speaking:]
I define a godly girl as a girl who is wholeheartedly pursuing God with her life.
A godly girl, to me, really understands that being a wife and a mother is an extremely high calling.

So to me, a godly girl is a girl who loves the Lord with all her heart and wants to serve Him.
To me, a godly girl is someone who is patient.

To me the most attractive thing about a girl is that she is really selfless.
I really admire when girls dress modestly.

I really admire a girl who is content with where God has her in life.
I admire a girl who has love for people.
I really admire a girl who is respectful towards her parents and is kind to her siblings.
Some character qualities that I really appreciate in a girl are selflessness, and a girl who is kind.

I admire a girl who gets outside of herself and invests in the lives of others.
I know a girl who really prioritizes God in her life. Every morning she talks with the Lord through prayer and reads her Bible and really just yearns to hear from the Lord.

Discipling Healthy Male/Female Relationships in the Church Part 1 by Wendy Alsup

Discipling Healthy Male/Female Relationships in the Church Part 1 by W. Alsup

I am fairly certain that the woman who wrote this is a gender complementarian.

I myself am a former (note: FORMER) gender complementarian. I believe that Ms. Alsup might be a “soft” complementarian. If I am mistaken about that, I am sorry.

I’m only somewhat familiar with Ms. Alsup’s writings and views, and if I am remembering correctly, she is not terribly extreme in her gender role views and sometimes writes blog posts criticizing aspects of gender comp, such as the one that follows, though I believe she may support beliefs that women are not to be preachers in churches and so on.

As I’ve noted on my own blog time and again, Christians, especially gender complementarian ones, tend to sexualize any and all persons and relationships.

Of course, secular culture and left wing Christians can also be very bad about sexualizing anything and everything, though, hypocritically, the progressives profess to feeling “icked out” by Christian sponsored “Daddy Daughter” balls and date.

The progressives who find “Daddy Daughter” dates to be patriarchal and incestuous in undertone are often the same ones who sexualize hetero male-female relationships, or male-male relationships.

Progressive Christians or ex Christians tend to operate in the school of “it’s impossible for men and women to be platonic friends.” You can view an example of that here, in left leaning SCCL’s facebook thread about (link): Daddy Daughter dates.

To a degree, I share some of their (their =  SCCL or liberal) reservations or concerns about “Daddy Daughter” dates, but then, I’m also not running around acting as though men and women are incapable of being buddies.  I am not insisting that any and all male-female relationships are sexual, or have sexual undertones, or the potential to be sexual.

One very unfortunate result of conservative Christians, especially the gender complementarians, sexualizing everyone and anything, is that unmarried, adult women are treated like suspected harlots and are consequently shunned or excluded from social events, church functions, or friendships with married persons.

Married persons are coached in Christian sermons, marriage blogs, and TV programs, to steer clear of single women. This practice of shunning single women is sometimes referred to as the “Billy Graham Rule.” (Please see the bottom of this post, under the “Related Posts” section, for links to more information about that.)

(Link): Discipling Healthy Male/Female Relationships in the Church Part 1 by Wendy Alsup

Excerpts:

  • … What was God’s purpose in creating two genders to work together to image Him out into His kingdom? For a time, conservative evangelicals simplistically set up marriage as the ultimate purpose for the creation of two genders, particularly around Genesis 2:18.

The LORD God said, “It is not good for the man to be alone. I will make a helper suitable for him.”

  • However, if you embrace Jesus as the key to understanding all of Scripture, then Jesus’ words on marriage in eternity give us necessary clarification on the purpose of the creation of two genders in Genesis 1 and 2.
  • God’s purposes for interactions between the two genders in this first sinless perfection in Eden is informed by glimpses of the second.
  • In Luke 20, the Sadducees ask Jesus a question about whose wife in heaven a woman would be if she had multiple husbands on earth. In His answer, Jesus is clear that in heaven we do not marry. (Actually, we do marry, but Jesus is the groom.) Jesus teaches us that the ultimate goal in perfection for men and women is not human marriage to each other.
  • But then, what is left for perfect male/female relationships if not human marriage? Well, a TON is left. But we are warped as a society away from valuing the vast wealth of human male/female relationships that don’t involve sex. 

Continue reading “Discipling Healthy Male/Female Relationships in the Church Part 1 by Wendy Alsup”

The Islamic Billy Graham Rule – Unmarried Muslim People Are Punished For Being Alone Together

The Islamic Billy Graham Rule – Unmarried Muslim People Are Punished For Being Alone Together

Just when I think I’m done blogging on this blog for the day (and I do have other stuff to do off-line), I keep seeing pertinent stuff show up all over the internet.

This turned up on my Twitter feed:

(Link): Indonesia: Police Beat Couple with Canes for Sharia Crime of Being Alone Together

  • Islamic sharia law was enforced with canes once again in Indonesia this week, including the cane beatings of a man and woman whose “crime” was being alone together in a guest room.
  • This was no crazed mob action, either, as (Link): CNN reports the sentence was handed down by a judge, and imposed by a special police unit “charged with finding people who violate sharia law.”
  • “The form of Islamic law is enforced in a very strict way in the area, including prohibiting unmarried people of different genders from being alone together,” CNN observes.

This totally reminds me of the insipid, sexist, ineffective, stupid, anti-singles Christian “Billy Graham Rule,” which I have blogged about before here (this view seems to turn up more in Christian gender complementarianism than it does Christian gender egalitarianism):

Except under the Christian BGR (Billy Graham Rule), you will get isolated, “tsk tsked,” or suspected of being a slut, rather than get whipped with a cane.

Also, and this is kind of funny in a sad way, Christians are stricter on this rule than the Muslims, in that they also look askance at single women who are alone with MARRIED men.

Single Christian women are doomed to live and die alone, because Christians who are inappropriately applying the “avoid even the appearance of evil” verse are ostracizing single women from every one, from other singles and from the marrieds. Similar the Islamic sharia rule that prohibits singles from being together.

Another dumb, oblivious, and naive thing about the BGR is that often times, married Christians end up having affairs with other married Christians.

Yet, I don’t usually see the same level of paranoia from Christians about married Christian women hanging out with married Christian men as I do the warnings about men being around un-married (single) women.

Here are some more links about the story (off site):

(Link):  The whipping girl: Screaming in agony, a woman collapses as she and a man are caned under Sharia law in Indonesia merely for being ‘seen in close proximity’ to each other without being married

  • The woman was accused of getting too close to a fellow university student
  • As the pair are unmarried, she had committed an offence under Sharia law
  • She was brought to a mosque where she was caned in front of a crowd
  • The woman received five lashes and at end had to be taken to hospital

(Link):  Crowd cheers as woman is brutally caned for being seen near man who wasn’t her husband

  • Dec 29, 2015
  • by Ruth Halkon
  • Nur Elita, 20, had to be taken away in an ambulance after being beaten in public outside her mosque under Sharia law
  • A crowd cheered as a young woman screamed in agony as she was repeatedly caned in punishment for being in ‘close proximity’ to a man she wasn’t married to.Nur Elita, 20, had to be removed from Baiturrahumim Mosque in Banda Aceh, Indonesia, in an ambulance after she was brutally punished for allegedly showing affection towards another university student.Under Sharia law, men and women who are unmarried and unrelated are not allowed to get too close.
  • Dec 31 2015
  • Officials in Banda Aceh, Indonesia, held a public caning Monday. At the end of the punishment, she collapsed on the floor and was carried off the stage into an ambulance and rushed to hospital. Indonesia enforce strict Islamic laws including prohibiting unmarried people from having sex.
  • Cheers went up as a masked man caned the woman, as a punishment for being “seen in close proximity” to a man she wasn’t married to, under Sharia law.
  • The young Acehnese woman is caned in public, a punishment under the Islamic sharia law.
  • Banda Aceh’s Deputy Mayor Zainal Arifin, who stood among the crowd, explained to bystanders that the punishments were meant to be a lesson for all and not simply entertainment.
  • After her ordeal, 23-year-old Wahyudi Saputra, the man whom she was alleged to have been in close proximity with breached was also striked. “And also, those who have been convicted are reminded not to repeat the same mistakes”, he added.

(Link):  Woman accused of ‘affectionate contact’ with man caned in Indonesia

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Related Posts:

(Link): Similar Views of Women Between Christian Gender Complmentarians and Islamic Group ISIS

(Link): Extremist Muslims Like Family Values Too – Muslims are joining ISIS / ISIL (extremist Islamic group) because they believe it supports “Family Values” – When Christianity and Islam sound alike

(Link):  Evangelicals are Rethinking Friendship and Sexuality 

(Link):  Non-Romantic Nearness, The Billy Graham Rule, and Pope John Paul’s Friendship With a Married Woman

(Link):  Jesus Christ was not afraid to meet alone with known Prostitutes / Steven Furtick and Elevation Church Perpetuating Anti Singles Bias – ie, Single Women are Supposedly Sexual Temptresses, All Males Can’t Control Their Sex Drives – (but this view conflicts with evangelical propaganda that married sex is great and frequent)

(Link):  Patriarchy tends to sexualize all male / female relationships (article via Junia Project blog)

Link):  Southern Baptists Pushing Early Marriage, Baby Making – Iranians Pushing Mandatory Motherhood – When Christians Sound Like Muslims

(Link): Why Christians Need To Stress Spiritual Family Over the Nuclear Family – People with no flesh and blood relations including Muslims who Convert to Christianity – Also: First World, White, Rich People Problems

(Link): Modesty Teachings – When Mormons Sound like Christians and Gender Complementarians

(Link): Mormons and Christians Make Family, Marriage, Having Children Into Idols

(Link):  Topics: Friendship is Possible / Sexualization By Culture Of All Relationships

(Link):  Relationships Of Welcome, Not Fear (Re: How Sexist Christian Views Marginalize and Isolate Adult, Single Women and Maintain Other Stereotypes About Adult Singles)

(Link):   How the Sexual Revolution Ruined Friendship – Also: If Christians Truly Believed in Celibacy and Virginity, they would stop adhering to certain sexual and gender stereotypes that work against both

(Link):  Hey Ed Stetzer: Opposite Gender Friendships Are Not Sinful – Ed Stetzer’s Advice: “Avoid Any Hint” – More Like: Re Enforce UnBiblical Stereotypes About Men, Women, Sex, and Singles

(Link):  Why So Much Fornication – Because Christians Have No Expectation of Sexual

(Link):  Pervy Preacher from Seattle who teaches men “to objectify women, by his over emphasis of sexualization of women and subservience” (Re Driscoll) Purity

(Link):  Brotherly Love: Christians and Male-Female Friendships

 

Patriarchy vs. Single Women in the Bible by B. and T. Jennings

Patriarchy vs. Single Women in the Bible by B. and T. Jennings

(Link): Patriarchy vs. Single Women in the Bible by B. and T. Jennings

This page I am linking to and excerpting below is critiquing one that was arguing that single women should stay at home.

The authors are addressing the author of the other page, a woman who explains she is still living at home and not going to college because she believed she was following biblical teachings for women.

Excerpts:

  • A response to an article regarding the reasons as to why a young Christian girl was not in college, but instead was staying under her father till marriage

Continue reading “Patriarchy vs. Single Women in the Bible by B. and T. Jennings”

Woman raised in the Bible Belt by religious parents says she ended up in TWO abusive relationships – because being banned from dating made her ‘ignorant’ about men

Woman raised in the Bible Belt by religious parents says she ended up in TWO abusive relationships – because being banned from dating made her ‘ignorant’ about men

(A link to a woman’s testimony about how Christian or religious dating advice as a kid hurt her as an adult is linked to farther below in this post.)

As I’ve written of before on my blog, much Christian teaching about dating, gender roles, and marriage – especially if espoused by Christians who believe in and teach something called “gender complementarianism” – can often leave marriage-minded singles single far longer than they wish, or perhaps permanently.

Christian teaching on dating, while intended to help singles date “safely” (i.e., to prevent pre-marital sex)  ironically erects obstacles for singles who’d like to get married.

One problem of Christian teaching about dating and singleness is to teach singles, to teach men and women, to be afraid of each other; never spend time alone with an opposite-gender person, lest it lead to fornication.

Well, the only way to marry is to first spend time with an opposite-gender person (assuming you are hetero), via dating.

If you are a lady, in order to discover if you are compatible with a guy, you need to spend time alone with him on dates, especially if you are an adult. (Group dating is for teens, not people over the age of 21.)

This woman’s testimony I link to farther down this page is yet another example of this situation, of how damaging the usual Christian dating advice and gender complementarianism is to singles, especially women.

The things she was taught growing up by her religious parents – things about dating, modesty, gender roles, etc – caused her relationship problems later in life.

Christian Gender Complementarianism infantilizes women, causes them to be naive, and teaches them it is wrong, unladylike, or selfish to have boundaries and to be assertive.

As you can see in this article, this was certainly a problem for the woman author, Lorens.

When she was confronted with vulgar, strange male clients at her job in a store, she did not know how to assert herself and tell them to shove off – or even if she could do so in the first place.

Continue reading “Woman raised in the Bible Belt by religious parents says she ended up in TWO abusive relationships – because being banned from dating made her ‘ignorant’ about men”

When Your Dad Dates Your Boyfriends: Inside Christian Courtship / More Erroneous Christian Ideas About Marriage, Dating, Singleness

When Your Dad Dates Your Boyfriends: Inside Christian Courtship / More Erroneous Christian Ideas About Marriage, Dating, Singleness

Regarding the article about courtship linked to much farther below (I had a bunch of things I wanted to pontificate about before getting to the article itself):

I do not support this, where the parent “chooses” the spouse for the daughter.

One reason: we are Americans living in 2015, we are not in India, where the culture is into arranged marriages. We are not in 3,000 BC in Israel, where arranged marriages were common.

I almost never hear of a situation where, in Christian culture, the father (or mother) chooses a mate for the son, it’s almost always for the daughter. So this practice reeks of sexism, for one thing.

I have no problem with parents advising their daughter on what traits to look for in a mate, and what qualities to be leery of, but this nonsense where the dad basically has “final say” over this choice?

No.

As a parent, you are to raise your daughter to be a fully independent adult, which means, when she is young, conveying your values to her, but it also means allowing her, when she gets older, to make her OWN choices, even if they are choices you may not agree with.

For a father to make these sorts of major life choices for his daughter is to infantalize her, and this will be dangerous to her as she grows older.

The daughter needs to be able to determine for herself what her boundaries are, and when and how to say “no” to men she dates.

There will be cases where dear old dad will not always be there for her, to hold the daughter’s hand through the dating process, so she will have to be able to fend for herself.

Another issue I have with these sorts of teachings, even the more “watered down” variety by run of the mill evangelical families, is that they are ensuring that their kid will face a lifetime of singledom, because the parents create mate selection lists that are too long and too stringent.

The typical Christian lists of requirements for a mate I have seen are so absurdly complicated and strict that there are NO MEN ALIVE who will meet the criteria on such lists.

Regarding this quote from the article:

  • Instead of relying on OkCupid’s [dating site] matchmaking algorithms, [in Christian families who believe in courtship] women and men entrust God to find them an eligible spouse.

If these parents believe it is up to God to send the girl a mate, why are the fathers getting involved at all? To be consistent in their beliefs, shouldn’t they be stepping aside?

At any rate, I too was raised to believe that I should “entrust God to find me an eligible spouse,” and here I am, over the age of 40, and still single.

All my years of waiting on God, trusting God, praying to God, going to churches to meet a potential spouse, and so on, left me single.

Using faith to get a spouse simply does not work.

Christians need to stop promoting belief and faith as a tool to get a spouse, because God is not involved in the process, apparently.

Regarding this summary from the article of what one Christian mother is teaching her daughters about being married one day:

  • And if God doesn’t like what He sees, He may not bless her with a kind and loving husband.

This mother’s views are incorrect and un-biblical. Marriage is not a reward for “good girls,” or girls who follow all the rules; it’s surely not presented as such in the Bible, and I can tell you based on real life experience, things do not work this way.

God is not going to with-hold a spouse from you because you sin, or have sex prior to marriage, or what have you.

I have blogged about this topic before, in two or three posts, including these:

I am a virgin over the age of 40. No penis has been in my vagina; I was a super sweet, godly Christian lady for many years – and yet, God did not “bless me” or “reward me” with a husband.

If anyone deserves a husband from God based on merit, surely it is myself – but God never sent me one.

Conversely, I have a long list of examples on my blog of ungodly, fat, stupid, drug addicted, or child molesting, wife abusing, serial raping, self-professing Christian people who ended up married.

If it were true that God doles out marriage as a reward to the obedient and faithful, then I would not be seeing the numerous stories on news sites about Christian men who do things like look at porn all day, who beat their wives up, who cheat and lie on their jobs, who sell drugs, who molest children, and so forth. But such scum of society, some of them Christian, do eventually get married.

Regarding this quote by the pro-courtship Mother:

  • “When you are born a girl, it doesn’t matter whether you give her all the guns and G.I. Joes in the world, she’s still going to dream about her wedding day,” Dawn says in the film. “We have the hormones. We have the makeup. It’s just who we are.”

Speak for yourself, sister.

Look, I had long wanted to be married, but I didn’t think strongly about the topic until my mid 20s or so.

I did NOT spend my youth or teen years “day dreaming” fondly about the dress I would wear one day, and so forth. I did not give getting married a lot of thought.

As a matter of fact, I do NOT like the idea of a big, expensive wedding, not then, and not now. Such weddings are impractical and a waste of money.

I grew up being a tom boy. I loved Bat Man, science fiction movies, riding my bike, and I wanted to buy and ride a motorcycle one day. My life was not defined by getting married one day. So it’s not a universal truth that all girls fixate on marriage and their wedding day.

I have some more observations below this very long series of excerpts:

(Link): When Your Dad Dates Your Boyfriends: Inside Christian Courtship

  • Ron Wright sees it as his duty to date his daughters’ prospective boyfriends to ensure they share his family’s Christian ideals.
  • A Courtship, which debuts at the Tribeca Film Festival this week, documents an Evangelical alternative to modern dating: Instead of relying on OkCupid’s matchmaking algorithms, women and men entrust God to find them an eligible spouse.
  • We meet the Wright family in their nondescript hometown outside Grand Rapids, Michigan, where Ron Wright runs an educational website promoting Christian courtship, BeforetheKiss.com.When he isn’t working as a snowplow dispatcher, Ron and his wife, Dawn, proselytize courtship to other Christians.Dawn homeschools their two daughters, aged 11 and 9, who are taught that secular dating is forbidden under Christian courtship.

Continue reading “When Your Dad Dates Your Boyfriends: Inside Christian Courtship / More Erroneous Christian Ideas About Marriage, Dating, Singleness”